corona virus crisis and detecting

adrian ss wrote:
The reason we do not see a massive surge in hospitalisations from the flu is because there is no Gov and media induced panic associated with it.

That is nonsense! The reasons we don;t see  a surge in hospitalisations  with the flu have  been explained to you! Yes flu is a serious disease but it does not have the potential to overwhelm our ICU bed/ventilator capacity like corona has done in other countries.

adrian ss wrote:Mick. Have you seen what the flu does to the older people who die from it. Not a pretty sight mate. Gasping for breath, bleeding lungs,  that have been infected by pneumonia, Falling into a coma. Bleeding kidneys and liver and bleeding in the brain....Just like those who die from the corona virus.
     How do I know? well I had pneumonia twice that developed from a simple cold and each time ended up in a coma and in hosp for two weeks each time. The only reason that I know I was in a coma is because Mum told me. I have no memory of it and very little memory of being in hospital.
The reason we do not see a massive surge in hospitalisations from the flu is because there is no Gov and media induced panic associated with it.

Ask the 1000s of people in Australia and 100,000 world wide who annually have lost family members to the flu as to whether it is a minor virus.
If ever there should be a lock down it is during flu season.

Adrian, yes the flu is bad. A typical flu season results in under 1000 deaths here in Australia and will infect about 300,000 people.
Corona if it infects only 300,000 people we would see upwards from 3000 people dead. However, if 300,000 people have contracted corona, it will not stop there, it will continue to ravage the entire population of 22,000,000, infecting about 18,000,000 and upwards of 180,000 deaths.

So think about it Adrian, flu under 1000 deaths, corona upwards of 180,000 deaths in one season. Who cares right? They were all going to die anyway.
At the moment you aren't seeing high numbers here because we have lock-downs and social distancing and we don't live on top of each other. We also currently have enough healthcare to manage the cases we do have.
As for flu reports this season, perhaps the lock downs, social distancing and isolation might have something to do with it. Think of all the things we could be rid of by just staying at home for 8 weeks!

Cheers Mick

The average deaths from flu in Australia in any one year is between 1500 and 3000, not less than 1000.
Look at what the flu has done in the past before we developed a vaccine for the various strains. 50,000,000 million deaths is not chicken feed.
It is capable of doing the same thing again if these designer viruses are allowed to get into the community like this latest corona virus....No way on Gods little earth did that start in a wet market

davsgold wrote:Once they start talking compulsory tracking, I draw the line on that one, what next.  What happened to our 'Free" country, our rights gone, well for now they have, and we trust that they will be restored sometime in the future.

Next thing will be a micro chip under the skin, that way you can't loose it, you can't forget to turn it on, it goes everywhere you go, you don't need to remember to charge it's battery. I can't believe how many people are totally brain washed now believing, everything the media and governments are saying..the method used is to say something enough over and over and you start to believe it........wake up people to what is actually happening, the virus is only a very minor part of what is going on.

Did you hear scomo this morning.
Said if at least 40 % of us do not download this new so called virus tracker the lock down restrictions will not be lifted...That of course is blackmail.
Starting to sound like a communistic run Gov where nobody has any true freedom.

I see that China wants to buy Virgin Air Lines...Like that is a surprise. Now that their virus is crippling the world and business is failing everywhere they suddenly are wanting to pounce on whatever they can get their grotty little hands into... Have they developed a vaccine long ago for this virus.

adrian ss wrote:The average deaths from flu in Australia in any one year is between 1500 and 3000, not less than 1000.
    Look at what the flu has done in the past before we developed a vaccine for the various strains. 50,000,000 million deaths is not chicken feed.
It is capable of doing the same thing again if these designer viruses are allowed to get into the community like this latest corona virus....No way on Gods little earth did that start in a wet market

I give up. Just go out, go to the shops, go fishing, do whatever the heck you like.

adrian ss wrote:
It is capable of doing the same thing again if these designer viruses are allowed to get into the community like this latest corona virus....No way on Gods little earth did that start in a wet market

That is pure speculation and another unproven conspiracy theory! Such speculation is unhelpful.Regardless of the origins of the virus the fact is that it is a global pandemic and the focus must be on  slowing its infectious growth, developing effective treatments and hopefully developing a safe and effective  vaccine.

planetcare wrote:

adrian ss wrote:
The reason we do not see a massive surge in hospitalisations from the flu is because there is no Gov and media induced panic associated with it.

That is nonsense! The reasons we don;t see  a surge in hospitalisations  with the flu have  been explained to you! Yes flu is a serious disease but it does not have the potential to overwhelm our ICU bed/ventilator capacity like corona has done in other countries.

No nonsense at all, when has the media intensity been applied during the flu season, the average have never seen what is going on in oversees hospitals during past flu seasons. The present virus is serious and the lockdown is necessary, but for the media to incite panic/extreme stress is criminal.
2020 winter flu season has passed in the Northern hemisphere, (anyone have the death rate?) we are now getting calls to book our flu vac, another year another season, we just hope we are spared.
My feelings are restrictions and tests should be applied every flu season for all immigrants.

It is no longer a conspiracy if you had listened to the news this morning.

Mechanic wrote:

adrian ss wrote:The average deaths from flu in Australia in any one year is between 1500 and 3000, not less than 1000.
    Look at what the flu has done in the past before we developed a vaccine for the various strains. 50,000,000 million deaths is not chicken feed.
It is capable of doing the same thing again if these designer viruses are allowed to get into the community like this latest corona virus....No way on Gods little earth did that start in a wet market

I give up. Just go out, go to the shops, go fishing, do whatever the heck you like.

I am not saying the lock downs and other regulations are wrong I am saying why not do the same for the flu.
When I contracted the flu I had no idea where it came from but it was during a flu season and people were coughing and sneezing from one end of the shopping centres to the other. People who go to work when they are feeling crook should be hung drawn and quartered because they cause everybody else to suffer.

adrian ss wrote:
I am not saying the lock downs and other regulations are wrong I am saying why not do the same for the flu.
 

 Because the flu does not have the infectious potential as corona virus!!!!

Nightjar wrote:

planetcare wrote:

adrian ss wrote:
The reason we do not see a massive surge in hospitalisations from the flu is because there is no Gov and media induced panic associated with it.

That is nonsense! The reasons we don;t see  a surge in hospitalisations  with the flu have  been explained to you! Yes flu is a serious disease but it does not have the potential to overwhelm our ICU bed/ventilator capacity like corona has done in other countries.

No nonsense at all, when has the media intensity been applied during the flu season, the average have never seen what is going on in oversees hospitals during past flu seasons. The present virus is serious and the lockdown is necessary, but for the media to incite panic/extreme stress is criminal.
2020 winter flu season has passed in the Northern hemisphere, (anyone have the death rate?) we are now getting calls to book our flu vac, another year another season, we just hope we are spared.
My feelings are restrictions and tests should be applied every flu season for all immigrants.


 

World wide flu death rates estimates.
https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2017/p1213-flu-death-estimate.html

[quote="Nightjar"
No nonsense at all, when has the media intensity been applied during the flu season, the average have never seen what is going on in oversees hospitals during past flu seasons. The present virus is serious and the lockdown is necessary, but for the media to incite panic/extreme stress is criminal.
2020 winter flu season has passed in the Northern hemisphere, (anyone have the death rate?) we are now getting calls to book our flu vac, another year another season, we just hope we are spared.
My feelings are restrictions and tests should be applied every flu season for all immigrants.

 [/quote]

Can you quote any recent examples of where the flu has overwhelmed the capacity of any developed countries health system like corona has done?

Japan didn't win the war but;

https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/rearvision/trading-with-the-enemy-the-australia-japan/3393730

planetcare wrote:

Can you quote any recent examples of where the flu has overwhelmed the capacity of any developed countries health system like corona has done?

There is no mention how the heath systems handled this because the media wasn't all over it creating world wide panic.
Figures here would suggest the medical teams were kept busy.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/2020/03/17/heres-how-coronavirus-compares-to-past-pandemics/

davsgold wrote:

planetcare wrote:[quote="Nightjar"
No nonsense at all, when has the media intensity been applied during the flu season, the average have never seen what is going on in oversees hospitals during past flu seasons. The present virus is serious and the lockdown is necessary, but for the media to incite panic/extreme stress is criminal.
2020 winter flu season has passed in the Northern hemisphere, (anyone have the death rate?) we are now getting calls to book our flu vac, another year another season, we just hope we are spared.
My feelings are restrictions and tests should be applied every flu season for all immigrants.

 

Can you quote any recent examples of where the flu has overwhelmed the capacity of any developed countries health system like corona has done?

I thinks this might have over run the hospital systems world wide.

"The Spanish flu, also known as the 1918 flu pandemic, was an unusually deadly influenza pandemic. Lasting from January 1918 to December 1920, it infected 500 million people – about a quarter of the world's population at the time. The death toll is estimated to have been anywhere from 17 million to 50 million, and possibly as high as 100 million, making it one of the deadliest pandemics in human history."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu[/quote]

Yes we know about the Spanish flu.But my question is asking about any recent (say in the last 10-20 years ) examples of where the flu has overwhelmed developed countries health systems like coroana has done in a number of countries.

adrian ss wrote:It is no longer a conspiracy if you had listened to the news this morning.

What the science says
https://www.sbs.com.au/news/the-feed/did-the-coronavirus-come-from-a-lab-in-wuhan-here-s-the-expert-view
The novel SARS-CoV-2 coronavirus that emerged in the city of Wuhan, China, last year and has since caused a large scale COVID-19 epidemic and spread to more than 70 other countries is the product of natural evolution, according to findings published today in the journal Nature Medicine.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/03/200317175442.htm
“Our analyses clearly show that SARS-CoV-2 is not a laboratory construct or a purposefully manipulated virus.”
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9

davsgold wrote:Once they start talking compulsory tracking, I draw the line on that one, what next.  What happened to our 'Free" country, our rights gone, well for now they have, and we trust that they will be restored sometime in the future.

wake up people to what is actually happening, the virus is only a very minor part of what is going on.

Dave there will be no tracking.
The app is a tracing app, not a tracking app.
You can turn the GPS function on your phone off if you wish.
The tracing app works on bluetooth alone, and does not need, nor use the GPS function.

It will record who you are in close contact with [by phone number]
Should you test positive in the future, this data will enable health officials to trace your contacts, and test them also,
and try and trace the source.
And that can only be a good thing.

you are reading too much into it.
2+2=4, not 144.

So the app is totally dependent on people telling the truth.
Most people here are already fed up with the restrictions on their life and the fast approaching collapse of our economy and their pension funds. Even though they are to some degree tolerating the situation...You can be sure that given a chance to toss a spanner in the works they will give it a go.

Just like the census and media surveys where everybody is honest. HA HAAA HAAAAAA And HAAAADY HA HAAH

Redfin wrote:

Dave there will be no tracking.
The app is a tracing app, not a tracking app.
You can turn the GPS function on your phone off if you wish.
The tracing app works on bluetooth alone, and does not need, nor use the GPS function.

Redfin, I'm not familiar with Bluetooth, all I know is it is turned off on my mobile as is the GPS function.
Are you saying that your mobile will trace your moves even if you have Bluetooth turned off? What about when you don't have reception?

adrian ss wrote:
Most people here are already fed up with the restrictions on their life and the fast approaching collapse of our economy and their pension funds. Even though they are to some degree tolerating the situation...You can be sure that given a chance to toss a spanner in the works they will give it a go.

Ok Adrian you obviously want  the restrictions relaxed .So what restrictions do you want relaxed?
But  if the restrictions are relaxed their will be a trade off in terms of  more infections and more deaths. The question I ask you is this: what trade off are you prepared to accept as a" reasonable" death rate, 50 deaths a week, 500 deaths a week or what?

This is interesting re Influenza in Aust 1989-2001
https://www1.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/cda-pubs-cdi-2001-cdi2503-cdi2503f.htm

4579 deaths from the flu in 1989.
I was in the RAAF then and was not even aware the flu was rampant



This could easily be the corona virus, Symptoms are near on identical

From: https://www1.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/cda-cdi3401b.htm
Abstract

The 2008 influenza season was moderate overall, with fewer laboratory-confirmed cases and influenza-like illness (ILI) presentations than in 2007, which was the most severe influenza season since national reporting of influenza began in 2001. In 2008, the number of laboratory-confirmed notifications for influenza was 1.9 times higher than the 5-year mean. High notification rates were reflected in an increase in presentations with ILI to sentinel general practices and emergency departments. Notification rates were highest in the 0–4 year age group. Unusually, the season was predominantly due to influenza B, with 54% of notifications being influenza B and 43% being influenza A (3% type unknown). The rate of influenza B was higher among the younger age groups, compared with influenza A, which was more common in the older age groups. Of influenza viruses circulating during the 2008 season, A(H3) viruses were predominant and were antigenically similar to the 2008 A(H3) vaccine strain, while the majority of A(H1) strains showed significant drift away from the 2008 A(H1) vaccine strain. There were approximately equal proportions of viruses from the 2 influenza B lineages B/Yamagata and B/Victoria. Commun Dis Intell 2010;34(1):8–22.
Top of page

Introduction
Influenza or ‘the flu’ is a common, highly infectious respiratory viral disease. The virus spreads from person to person by airborne droplets of exhaled respiratory secretions, especially by coughing or sneezing.1 Typical symptoms include sudden onset of fever, sore throat, runny nose, cough, fatigue, headache, and aches and pains.

Influenza causes annual epidemics of respiratory disease. Influenza epidemics usually occur during the winter months in temperate climates, causing an increase in hospitalisations for pneumonia, an exacerbation of chronic diseases and also contributing to increased mortality. Those most susceptible include the elderly and very young people, or people of any age who have a higher risk of complications (e.g. pneumonia, heart failure) due to certain chronic medical conditions, e.g. heart, lung, kidney, liver, immune, or metabolic diseases. Most healthy children and adults only have minor symptoms.

Laboratory-confirmed influenza is a nationally notifiable disease in all states and territories and data are reported from each state or territory health department to the National Notifiable Diseases Surveillance System (NNDSS).

In temperate zones of Australia, the annual influenza season runs from May to October, with a peak in notifications around the middle of August. The severity of seasons varies from year to year. Australia experienced moderate to severe seasons in 2003 and 2007 but mild seasons in other years. In recent years, influenza A has been the predominant type circulating in Australia, most commonly the A(H3) subtype.

Fellas, I can see this discussion on the current COVID-19 crisis is getting us nowhere less constant arguing amongst our selves.
If people here believe our government is not doing the right thing by us all, then lodge your protests with the government, instead of bickering to & fro amongst our selves, to no available end.
Our government is asking us all to be patient, towards doing what we have to do, in order to help us get through this current crisis as quickly & as fast as we possibly can.They're not working for themselves, but for the protection/safety of us all. If we can't or are not prepared to listen to our leaders now, then I can't imagine the consequences we the people of Australia face, in a time of invading war.
It is said that a man is a slave to whatever he allows to overpower him. So forget about the brainwashing part through the media/government or through whatever else, for Australia & its laws have given us the right of freedom to choose, which is more than I can say for many other a nation.
Adrian, freedom of speech I allow, but only to the point of it getting us somewhere. If I see it going round in circles getting us nowhere, just for the sake of more arguments/bickering amongst our selves, then I will have to draw the line of agreeing to disagree & will have no option but to lock down this "Off Topic" thread, for the sake of getting back to what we as detectorists/prospectors should be talking about.
Ahh who am I kidding, for I'm pretty sure all that I'v said above, is bound to fall on deaf ears.

Cheers Kon.

As already mentioned I know very little about bluetooth but did read that it can be detrimental to brain function? Can anyone prove or disprove this? You'll get on Dave, sucking up to Kon, you'll be inviting him to join us when the 7000's get fired up again.

Biggest crowd I've seen for weeks, petrol at Metro Maryborough this morning 79.9. diesel 102.9

I hear you fellas & do understand the anguish we all feel & are going through at the moment, but less the odd ignorant/arrogant careless individual, that insists on going against the flow, (which is all to be expected on a good day, not alone under these unprecedented times)  Australians can be proud of themselves for doing the right thing & know that compared to the rest of the world, we're one of the few nations, well ahead at winning the fight against this virus outbreak. This is why I say (& regardless of each ones whinging including my own), by continuing to do the right thing by one another, keeping this virus at bay, will be only a matter of time now, before stage 3 restrictions start easing up & we can all get back to doing what we enjoy most.
Rest assured Nightjar for my personal family commitments, won't allow me to go on any major expedition/camping trips anytime soon, so yours & Dave's gold localities are safe for now      

Cheers Kon.