19" GPZ 7000 Coil info.

Very helpful Gypsy, thanks a lot.

This is a hoot...

.."Relevant factors in detector plus coil performance include, but are not limited to, detector settings, ground type, mineralisation levels and type, electromagnetic interference, gold nugget size, shape and composition, and operator skill level."....

BUT!!!!.....if you are doing 14 vs 19' comparison (again...COMPARISON) ALL the issues above are actually NON issues as the playing ground is equal.....if it's 'hot ground' for one, it's hot for the other etc....if there's 'emi' it's on both,..the
'shape & composition' is the same....'gold nugget size'....Time to get real Codan.....


I dunno...Codan on the one hand continue to use % depth improvement with each new model (most likely as 'perceived' variance) and then spend time and money 'debunking' that figure by being airy fairy with such as above....wtf Codan, why not just tell the TRUTH, without making claims....just drop the constant depth improvements as it is losing you FACE!!! in the community.

Rant/off

Gypsy

Your welcome Reg,...

I note you didn't respond to alchemist regarding his info. though...

Have you done the update he spoke of? (hard to tell as you had a lucky one that didn't need it, hence the query)

You may still be lucky, and just don't know it....

Gypsy

alchemist wrote:GGA I have bought this coil but will not get an opportunity to test it out for a couple of weeks, Reg's comments robbed me of sleep last night what am I to do?

Perhaps visit Reg and rub his head. Perhaps you can rob him of some of that luck?
Hope to hell you got a 'lucky one'?......

Hang in there alchemist....don't shoot the dog before a run in the paddock...

Gypsy

Yeah thanks Gypsy, I tend to over react....

I'm quite partial to a bit of Orange Roughy myself, but the best I can hope for are tiddlers in comparison, perhaps Reg has higher expectations than me?

Yes time to sit back and see how some others go, I see a dude on JP's FB page scored an 80+ gram "speck" would be nice to hear the full story.

Cheers

The 86 gramer on JP Facebook page was only 12 14 inches deep.

Lately for me it seems i am hearing more (white) noise these days about good finds...and with ALL types of detectors as well.

Though it must be said, quite a few needed big yella before being detected.

Still..it's heartening to hear it's still out there even for the enthusiast to grab...

I either haven't walked over the big one yet, or had the wrong coil on that day if i did walk it. (for me a more likely scenario lol)

Gypsy

Reg Wilson wrote: the primary objective was to pick up what Porter calls 'big nuggets'. This is what we are led to believe will jump out, like the bits he holds, grinning all over his face.  'Come in spinner'.

Reg, I need to point out a couple of points before I let this sleeping dog alone.

JP didn't say they would "jump out" at you, in fact he said "Large deep nuggets are a learned approach with ZVT."

If you didn't update the firmware on your machine, your testing as far as I can ascertain is invalid with respect to the production 19" coil.

Kev.

Reg Wilson wrote:Slimpickens, no, that's not what I'm saying, but the primary objective was to pick up what Porter calls 'big nuggets'. This is what we are led to believe will jump out, like the bits he holds, grinning all over his face.  'Come in spinner'.

19''
Post Reg Wilson Yesterday at 8:48 pm

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Kon ,remember the Z claims of 40% over GPX, and now the 30% claims over 14'' Z ? So correect me if I'm wrong, but that would be be a cumulative increase or 70% would it not? But hey let's go back to to the first of the PI's, the 2000, and look at the increase in depth claims that have taken place with each model since. Going on these claims, we should need a backhoe to dig some signals. Unfortunately ML have become the masters of bullshit. Work it out for yourself. They still make good detectors, but credability, ha, don't make me laugh. They used to be a good company once. Past tense. Proudly made in Malaysia

It would seem that there is a little disenchantment over the new 19" coil, hmmm this looks very similar to the points I made in a recent topic that was deleted, some of the good folks in the detecting world seemed to have been taken in by the "Advertising PROPAGANDA"

Alchemist, my 7000 has had the update, but I couldn't notice any difference.

Reg Wilson wrote:Alchemist, my 7000 has had the update, but I couldn't notice any difference.

Hmmm you have me worried again, perhaps spinner has indeed come in!

rc62burke wrote:
Kon ,remember the Z claims of 40% over GPX, and now the 30% claims over 14'' Z ? So correect me if I'm wrong, but that would be be a cumulative increase or 70% would it not? But hey let's go back to to the first of the PI's, the 2000, and look at the increase in depth claims that have taken place with each model  since. Going on these claims, we should need a backhoe to dig some signals. [/b]

It would seem that there is a little disenchantment over the new 19" coil, hmmm this looks very similar to the points I made in a recent topic that was deleted, some of the good folks in the detecting world seemed to have been taken in by the "Advertising PROPAGANDA" [/color] 

Firstly, no Reg, i don't imagine the 'math' works linearly, nor is it the way ML would do so, so you (and i suspect others with the same expectation) have arrived at an incorrect assumption to base your 'expectations' stance from, and as such set out to fail before you bought it.

Based on your own arguement, re;.."But hey let's go back to to the first of the PI's, the 2000, and look at the increase in depth claims that have taken place with each model since."... were you to do that, i'm sure you'd find (the lineal method) would have us digging 3' holes using an 11" coil for a 3gm 'speck'. (as you noted - a "back-hoe").....now think just a minute,.......no, think. If the 'math' being used in this instance WERE lineal, then why is not your supposition our reality????

rc62burke, the above may be why this is occurring among the throng who have 'possibly' FALSE expectations???

Perhaps not 'soley', yet i am sure it is a contributor...

Gypsy

'possibly' FALSE expectations based upon charts and advertising that we, as consumers should be able to rely upon.

I just wonder how much this timed release was influenced by bean counters?

Maybe the 19" like the Z's performance is hobbled in the triangle, although I've not seen many decent bits coming from JPs production disk.

alchemist wrote:'possibly' FALSE expectations based upon charts and advertising that we, as consumers should be able to rely upon.

I just wonder how much this timed release was influenced by bean counters?

Maybe the 19" like the Z's performance is hobbled in the triangle, although I've not seen many decent bits coming from JPs production disk.

Maybe they should have stuck to the GPX housing the new beast & used the "Prototype" coil it obviously sucked out the big ones

Did I mention that it's heavy ! Bloody hell it's heavy. 3 hours of moving it through some pretty heavy rye grass and weeds had my arm winging ! Even with a heavy duty bungy.

Will give it another crack tomorrow in some ground that is not so heavy with growth, then 3 days next week in some state forest where the 14 inch coil has pulled some nice bits.  

I can't see this coil being my main prospecting coil, rather one to clean up after the 14 has had a go !  Or maybe use the 19 in the morning, then swap to the 14 for the arvo !  

Rick

alchemist wrote:'possibly' FALSE expectations based upon charts and advertising that we, as consumers should be able to rely upon.

What i was alluding to was the 'way' the 'math' was applied for ML to come to their %'s, and that it isn't necessarily 'lineal', which WOULD lead  folks to believe 30% + 40% over that somehow equals 70% total,...which is just not correct in this instance, and hence where the 'possible false expectation' comes into play.

IE; it is possible the charts are reading correctly(based on ML's methodology), it 'may' just be the 'interpretation' is incorrect...

My FINAL word, and advice for those concerned, your already online, send ML a mail and get it from the horses mouth, and not from outside postulations or assumptions...all i know is, i can't tell you, 'cos i wasn't there...

If ML don't get back to you (perhaps citing BC or TP etc) then, i guess this is all you have left open to you...lol

TBH,...i never concern myself that much with it, i go detecting, i find gold (sometimes) and i'm happy. It is when i STOP finding gold that i will reserve my whinghing for...

Gypsy

AraratGold wrote:Did I mention that it's heavy ! Bloody hell it's heavy. 3 hours of moving it through some pretty heavy rye grass and weeds had my arm winging ! Even with a heavy duty bungy.

Will give it another crack tomorrow in some ground that is not so heavy with growth, then 3 days next week in some state forest where the 14 inch coil has pulled some nice bits.  

I can't see this coil being my main prospecting coil, rather one to clean up after the 14 has had a go !  Or maybe use the 19 in the morning, then swap to the 14 for the arvo !  

Rick

Rick, 2 things to do.
1) The obvious... use a hip stick.
2) Use the bludging left arm ( if your right handed) to push  and pull the swing arm and take some of the work load off your right arm and wrist.

slimpickens wrote:

AraratGold wrote:Did I mention that it's heavy ! Bloody hell it's heavy. 3 hours of moving it through some pretty heavy rye grass and weeds had my arm winging ! Even with a heavy duty bungy.

Will give it another crack tomorrow in some ground that is not so heavy with growth, then 3 days next week in some state forest where the 14 inch coil has pulled some nice bits.  

I can't see this coil being my main prospecting coil, rather one to clean up after the 14 has had a go !  Or maybe use the 19 in the morning, then swap to the 14 for the arvo !  

Rick

Rick, 2 things to do.
1) The obvious... use a hip stick.
2) Use the bludging left arm ( if your right handed) to push  and pull the swing arm and take some of the work load off your right arm and wrist.

Was doing both, it's just a heavy mofo, and the lush paddock didn't help !
Rick

[quote="AraratGold"][quote="slimpickens"]

AraratGold wrote:

Was doing both, it's just a heavy mofo, and the lush paddock didn't help !
Rick

Yeah I know, that long grass with the purple flower is a b**tard to push through.

just bear in mind- every nugget can be detected at its own depth. totally dependent on its size, shape, surface area and make up and of course the ground it is in. the depth increase is based on an average taken on multiple nuggets in multiple settings. i would love for the expert testers to take say 100 nuggets of all sizes, shapes and makeups and do their tests based on that, then take an average. 2 days with this coil aint nearly enough to pass judgement imho.
i have a nugget of 2grams that is solid but has a bubbly surface that is totaly invisible to pulse induction machines unless you touch the coil. in an air test the zed can hear it easily at 8" but was dug out of a hole 13" deep with a pin pointer used- and it was in the bottom of the hole. how many % increase in depth would that work out to? (this was found with the 14"coil in FP settings on day 2 with my zed.)

Reg Wilson wrote:Alchemist, my 7000 has had the update, but I couldn't notice any difference.

Hi Reg, Maybe you have a faulty coil. Are you able to try your coil on another zed or maybe try some one else's coil on your zed??

JW

Even better when you find,it was found deeper in the ground than the results of a later air test. Although air tests will never substitute for un-dug/undisturbed,gold nuggets found in their natural state,they do tell us several things when compared to one machine/coil combination,to another.
When testing between same model detector coil combinations,all detector parameters/settings,should be done in "Factory Preset Modes"
Considering the many variables involved when listening to signals,coming from undisturbed/in-ground gold nuggets,(of who knows how long?) air testing (although can never be identically replicated or substituted for an undisturbed in ground gold nugget),"will" tell us what detector/coil combo does this,as compared to another of the same detector/settings,using a different size coil.
In the case of the new 19 inch GPZ coil,all I need to find out,is if the 19 inch coil goes deeper on a range of nuggets tested beyond the 2+ gram mark over that of the 14x13 inch coil.
The promised average 30% might not come in an air test (as was first shown with the 14x13 Super D) but,I have no doubt,being a much larger coil,we will see,significant depth increase,on slugs of gold beyond the 1oz + mark,than what the 14x13 could ever achieve.
Lets face it. No GPZ user is buying this heavier,larger,19 inch Super D coil,for the purpose of chasing Fly sh*t,although (from some reports so far),its good to know,that it also has the capability of detecting less than half gram sized gold,nearer the surface.

Cheers Kon.

Hmm, couple of cheap 19" coils on Gumtree!

http://tinyurl.com/j872eds
http://tinyurl.com/zvcborw

Yep Inhere & it basically means nothing.Both clearly state that the new coils go deeper and are asking for $1500+ for them,but how would they know,if they haven't used them out on the field? There are many reasons why people buy,try & then immediately sell.
Underestimating fitness for purpose,is one of them. I refuse to believe they risked buying the 19 inch coils for the discount price of $1300,in order to make a lousy $200 profit. To much to risk,for such little gain

Cheers Kon.

Kon, I'm eager to hear yours, Slims and others conclusions also.

If in malign soil it only matches or gives up to 15% gain over the 14" it will still have a place in my kit as far as I'm concerned. For any new wide spread dab it will allow faster coverage, which in the end will surely mean more gold for the hours invested.

For those of us who don't live in a goldfield and have to travel long distances to reach good ground, greater coverage of that ground in the alloted time has to be worth the weight and cost of this brute of a thing.

Cheers
Kev.

Alchemist, it is painfully obvious that you have not swung it yet.

Reg Wilson wrote:Alchemist, it is painfully obvious that you have not swung it yet.

Correct, it's well over half a kg more than I'm used to, and for once I will need to break out my hipstick and bungee.
I think it will also need a polycarbonate plate taped to the underside from wing to wing. The swing arm will also be a must.

Is there anymore you can recommend Reg.?

Now you're going to tell me I will need to swing it slower than the 14.....right?

Don't like your change of moniker. Get rid of it and I'll consider answering your questions.

Sorry Reg, I can't help being an '***** expert' I do the best I can with what I've got.

Many will appreciate your honesty, but for me as an amateur I'm still holding out a bit of hope that somewhere it will earn its keep.