GPZ 7000 coil

Anybody else noticed there doesn't seem to be a coil lead showing in the photographs?  Did notice a strange looking protrusion below and underneath the stem mount on the coil.  Maybe this coil has a transmitter and receiver and no lead?  Would make coil changes easy and quick and opens a lot of interesting options as far as swinging the coil is concerned if this is the case!   I'm probably way off base but no worse than some of the other speculations going on here
Cheers,
Frank

You saw that too.?
Thought it might have been a stopper.....but why would you need a stopper i says to myself.

Coil lead goes inside the stem upto the housing, same as the CTX3030, which this GPZ7000 uses as a housing for all the goodies that go on the inside.

cheers dave

davsgold wrote:Coil lead goes inside the stem upto the housing, same as the CTX3030, which this GPZ7000 uses as a housing for all the goodies that go on the inside.

cheers dave

G'day Dave,

How do you know this ??

From what I can gather it's just a dummy in the pic..

Finderskeepers in Kal, last year had a dummy SDC2300 on display before it's release, not to shore if other dealer's went this way,
I have feeling this will be the same for next model. 


Cheers Mick

Dave, I also have a CTX3030 as well and the picture of the coil stem on the GPZ 7000 looks nothing like it.  The lead on the 3030 coil passes through the bottom portion of the stem which is larger than the rest of the stem above it and is quite visible.
The picture of the GPZ stem appears  to be smaller and cast as a solid piece with webbed reinforcements.  If the ad photos are accurate, it would be hard not to see a lead coming out of the coil or into the stem.  Also being a PI detector. I would think having a floating lead in the stem would make it visible to the detector if there was any movement whatsoever such as bumping the coil etc.  Anyway this is all speculation so I am probably way off base.
Cheers,
Frank

Also being a PI detector. I would think having a floating lead in the stem would make it visible to the detector if there was any movement whatsoever such as bumping the coil etc.

PIs as we know them, cant see the coil lead. Be it up a shaft, or waved across a working coil.
If the PI cannot see the coil lead, EMI getting into the lead would have to be pretty rare also.?

In the pic it looks like a sensor of some kind, but its placed in an area you would place a stopper, for what ever reason you would want to put a stopper there.?

ML were doing some work on a coil sensor from what i read in one of their patents....perhaps this is it.?   Could be i misunderstood what i was reading to.?

Narrawa you are absolutely right, I had a momentary brain fart and was confusing coil plug noise into the control box that occurs with movement.  Have had a big day in the sun and few remaining brain cells are fatigued

mickAurum wrote:

davsgold wrote:Coil lead goes inside the stem upto the housing, same as the CTX3030, which this GPZ7000 uses as a housing for all the goodies that go on the inside.

cheers dave

G'day Dave,

How do you know this ??

From what I can gather it's just a dummy in the pic..

Finderskeepers in Kal, last year had a dummy SDC2300 on display before it's release, not to shore if other dealer went this way,
I have feeling this will be the same for next model.


Cheers Mick

Well, because it looks so much like the CTX3030 in the leaked pictures from Minelab themselves, I think if you cant see the cable...........then where else would it go.............wireless you say, that's a novel idea............well maybe it is wireless, may as well add another rumour. I think it was better when they said nothing and a new model just turned up in the dealers shops.

If its just a dummy pic to throw us all of, then if you can't trust leaked info what can you trust.

cheers dave

I'm sure it will be much clearer when I have one in my hands.

No worries Davsgold,

We all have to wait and see when it comes out.

Cheers Mick

After market coil makers are doing it hard I feel (could be wrong). I would expect any big company would love the idea of cornering the coil market with a new design that ensures they once again get the coil sales, please the shareholders and close the after market guys down.

I hope for the sake of future coil improvement and choice that the Coilteks and Nuggetfinders and Detechs can make coils to suit the new platform. would love to know what the coil manufacturers view is.
Tributer

If the coil was wireless how would the power from the batteries get to the coil from the battery pack on the other end. ML might be good but they are not that good.

Damn Geof, You would have to spoil the fantasy with logic and science

geof_junk wrote:If the coil was wireless how would the power from the batteries get to the coil from the battery pack on the other end. ML might be good but they are not that good.

Probably the same way they do it with the Deus XP !

If the coil was wireless

Who said the coil was wireless.?

It could be wireless, and that thing we are looking at could be a rubber grommet for the plug in charger.?  

A sensor in the coil could be for many things..... filtering EMI could be one.?
Tuning / alignment / sync.??

It may house a chip for scanning/registration purposes.?

Yet it maybe just a stopper of some sort.?

Narrawa wrote:

If the coil was wireless

Who said the coil was wireless.?

It could be wireless, and that thing we are looking at could be a rubber grommet for the plug in charger.?  

A sensor in the coil could be for many things..... filtering EMI could be one.?
Tuning / alignment / sync.??

It may house a chip for scanning/registration purposes.?

Yet it maybe just a stopper of some sort.?

Or it might be a drain plug to drain water from the coil after using it in the water.

cheers dave

Probably the same way they do it with the Deus XP !

Deus XP as 3 battery systems the one in the coil has the lowest use life. The power used in a VLF detector is very low, the old Garrett's used four 9 volts battery to power the the whole detector a two for the speaker/ear phones. A PI power requirement are much higher ie The heavy 6 volts in the SD2000.

Gent's been reading this forum for years and enjoy your insight with our hobby. Finally registered this eve! The first thing I noticed with this coil is no coil skid plate seam line? Then read this threads name and noticed what was pointed out. My Wife has a new Jeep with one of them push a button to start the vehicle up as long as the key bob is nearby. I believe the keyless technology is ZVT, don't know if it has anything to do with the coil? But we are getting closer to full disclosure of this new unit! Us State side are in the same boat as you $. Until the next hunt

LuckyLundy

Edited...
oops...wrong thread

PS... LuckyLundy, welcome aboard.

Narrawa wrote:

Also being a PI detector. I would think having a floating lead in the stem would make it visible to the detector if there was any movement whatsoever such as bumping the coil etc.

PIs as we know them, cant see the coil lead. Be it up a shaft, or waved across a working coil.
If the PI cannot see the coil lead, EMI getting into the lead would have to be pretty rare also.?

In the pic it looks like a sensor of some kind, but its placed in an area you would place a stopper, for what ever reason you would want to put a stopper there.?

ML were doing some work on a coil sensor from what i read in one of their patents....perhaps this is it.?   Could be i misunderstood what i was reading to.?

The detector can detect the lead if it moves in relation to the coil, its called 'lead flashing' that is why its important to have your leads secured, or you will get random noises every time you bump the coil and the lead moves in relation to the coil.

Lead flashing could be a big problem if the lead was inside the shaft and became loose.
I think minelab would defiantly know this that's why it would appear that they have cleverly designed the coil with an attached piece of shaft in which the lead can easily be permanently secure.
I think all of the new coils for the gpz will have this piece of shaft attached and the connection point to the main shaft will also be the coil plug.
That's how I would have designed it and that's how it appears they have done it to me.

Hey Goldhound,

I think you might be onto something there, that would make sense, and a change in design, so they have the monopoly back on their product.

Being constant current coil with a return coil, I don't see it possible been wireless.

mickAurum wrote:Hey Goldhound,

I think you might be onto something there, that would make sense, and a change in design, so they have the monopoly back on their product.

Being constant current coil with a return coil, I don't see it possible been wireless.

Yeah mate
I also heard from a reliable source that the coil is not like a traditional dd but is two mono windings with the tx slightly smaller than the Rx so mathematically it will not be half the Rx area like a traditional dd coil which is where you loose depth on a traditional dd because on a traditional dd you have halved your Rx area and lost depth because of it and the inverse square law of diminishing response of the target and the smaller Rx area of the dd is where your loss of depth is in relation to dd coils.

If this is true it might have the depth potential of a mono mathematically but maybe the ground canceling ability and benefit of dedicated tx and Rx coils.

As in a traditional mono the detector has to wait for the tx pulse to decay before starting the Rx.
I can see major benefits over older tech if this is what they have done.

Seems like there was discussion about this coil late last year.

I am hoping it will find the smallest of bits as well as super deep targets with the 3 in one coil it come with it.

https://golddetecting.forumotion.net/t20451-super-d-search-coil

cheers dave

The detector can detect the lead if it moves in relation to the coil, its called 'lead flashing' that is why its important to have your leads secured, or you will get random noises every time you bump the coil and the lead moves in relation to the coil.

Iv tested this to the point of boredom. And im probably the most careless when it comes to winding the leads on my shaft.....they are kept lose-ish so that if the coil becomes upright, there i no pulling on where it enters the coil housing, nor the control box housing. Never an issue with the big coils either. I have never seen a coil lead interfere when waved over a working detector yet.?
There's simply to much room for error if this was the case.?

The only reason the cable would run up the shaft of the 7k, is because thats the design of the 3030 housing.

Hmmm?

Detrackozi what do u mean by 3 in one??

Narrawa wrote:

The detector can detect the lead if it moves in relation to the coil, its called 'lead flashing' that is why its important to have your leads secured, or you will get random noises every time you bump the coil and the lead moves in relation to the coil.

Iv tested this to the point of boredom. And im probably the most careless when it comes to winding the leads on my shaft.....they are kept lose-ish so that if the coil becomes upright, there i no pulling on where it enters the coil housing, nor the control box housing. Never an issue with the big coils either. I have never seen a coil lead interfere when waved over a working detector yet.?
There's simply to much room for error if this was the case.?

The only reason the cable would run up the shaft of the 7k, is because thats the design of the 3030 housing.

I agree that the only reason that the cord runs up the middle of the shaft is because of platform design.
The effect is called lead flashing by detector technician's.
But I disagree with the detector not being able to detect the lead as in my tests it can, its worst when proximity is changed.

How can it not be effected by a metallic object moving over the coil ?
Is the detector not a motion detector that detects moving metallic object's?
Is the coil lead not made of copper wire?

I'm not having a go narrawa I've just had it detect in my tests repeatedly.
Same prob with the stupid ally upper shaft that comes standard, I change that to a fiberglass one as the big coil detects it every time the coil is bumped up or down.

GoldHound wrote:

Narrawa wrote:

The detector can detect the lead if it moves in relation to the coil, its called 'lead flashing' that is why its important to have your leads secured, or you will get random noises every time you bump the coil and the lead moves in relation to the coil.

Iv tested this to the point of boredom. And im probably the most careless when it comes to winding the leads on my shaft.....they are kept lose-ish so that if the coil becomes upright, there i no pulling on where it enters the coil housing, nor the control box housing. Never an issue with the big coils either. I have never seen a coil lead interfere when waved over a working detector yet.?
There's simply to much room for error if this was the case.?

The only reason the cable would run up the shaft of the 7k, is because thats the design of the 3030 housing.

I agree that the only reason that the cord runs up the middle of the shaft is because of platform design.

But I disagree with the detector not being able to detect the lead as in my tests it can, its worst when proximity is changed.

How can it not be effected by a metallic object moving over the coil ?
Is the detector not a motion detector that detects moving metallic object's?
Is the coil lead not made of copper wire?

I'm not having a go narrawa I've just had it detect in my tests repeatedly.
Same prob with the stupid ally upper shaft that comes standard, I change that to a fiberglass one as the big coil detects it every time the coil is bumped up or down.

I'II back you up on that theory Goldhound,

I have notice the mono coils will detect it's lead, especially sitting the detector down with coil flat on ground.

I agree that the only reason that the cord runs up the middle of the shaft is because of platform design.
The effect is called lead flashing by detector technician's.
But I disagree with the detector not being able to detect the lead as in my tests it can, its worst when proximity is changed.

How can it not be effected by a metallic object moving over the coil ?
Is the detector not a motion detector that detects moving metallic object's?
Is the coil lead not made of copper wire?

I'm not having a go narrawa I've just had it detect in my tests repeatedly.
Same prob with the stupid ally upper shaft that comes standard, I change that to a fiberglass one as the big coil detects it every time the coil is bumped up or down.

Lead flashing if it was a problem, has been unresolved since day dot.....how many detectors have been out there since day dot with the lead wrapped up the stem.?
The lead is 99.9% invisible to a working coil.

Agreed about the upper metal shaft being seen by large coils, but its no more of a problem then the c/box. It moves in relation to the coil which would have slightly desensitized...slightly. If these were major problems, they would have been addressed when Adam was boy. You'll find no more gold with a full Otto shaft then you will with the std shaft....same detector same coil...there's just not enough in it. The only benefit really is weight.


Not being clever, but this is not new news.

How interesting, you both seem to be having very different experiences on this matter,    now this bothers me a little   seeing as I rely heavily on both of your opinions, I wonder what it is that either of you does differently that gives you the opposite result to each other, someone please enlighten us.

Wayne.

Digginerup wrote:How interesting, you both seem to be having very different experiences on this matter,    now this bothers me a little   seeing as I rely heavily on both of your opinions, I wonder what it is that either of you does differently that gives you the opposite result to each other, someone please enlighten us.

Wayne.

G'day Wayne,

There's never two things the same, as it's impossible to occupy the same space at same time...........never two coils or detectors the same, tolerances,
resistances, manufactures, and so on.......... you will know what I'm getting at....
If the coax coil lead had straight wires no curls or bumps kinks and good shielding, good current flow,
then it should be invisible to the coil.

Agreed about the upper metal shaft being seen by large coils, but its no more of a problem then the c/box. It moves in relation to the coil which would have slightly desensitized...slightly. If these were major problems, they would have been addressed when Adam was boy. You'll find no more gold with a full Otto shaft then you will with the std shaft....same detector same coil...there's just not enough in it. The only benefit really is weight.

I'll stick with the Otto shaft, the aluminium upper shaft is the first thing that gets changed on a new (now old) detector when first purchased. The aluminium shaft is quite a way closer to the coil than the control box so it's would be the first thing to be seen.

Even though it move in relation to the coil the desensitizing effect is still taking place. This is much more of a factor to be taken into account with large mono coils, remember the older model GP and GPX detectors only came out with DD coils and so this was not so much of a concern.

If it had no real effect then why not have even the lower shaft aluminium, as that still moves in relation to the coil as well.

And I will never know if I would have found the same amount of gold with the standard upper shafts as opposed to the Otto shafts as it was pointed out to me the benefit of the otto shaft.

cheers dave