FAKE 18" COILTEK COIL showed up... (pics & video)

A guy approached me with a very convincing looking 18 inch (mono/round) Coiltek Coil under his arm and wanted me to take a look at it. His 71 year old mother had bought it for him as a gift for the princely sum of $570 (I'm not sure if it was purchased online or from another person directly) but his mother lives in Kalgoorlie and she bought it in Western Australia earlier this week.
...Unfortunately it was a fake.



You can view the video HERE:

Some pics can be viewed below. The guy asked me to circulate the images to warn others. I spoke with Coiltek and they agreed that this was not a genuine coil. The fakes are known to be very under-performing in the best of circumstances. Some don't work at all - so beware of the peddlers.

Buying coils on Ebay is now a very risky business indeed.



This is the fake coil. Didn't have another 18" round mono on hand to compare it with so an 18" elliptical coil was used.


The decals look VERY convincing. And the serial numbers on the Fakes are changing too. Now they've started to produce a shiny grommet too. Previous fakes used matte ones.


The fake cable connector is on the left. With the logo decals, the fake has a white background and the real one has a silver-grey-white background.


The fake coil had a slightly raised red ink on the surface. Real label is on the LEFT... the Fake is on the RIGHT.


The fake (below) was has a very similar printing process on the coil cable to the original Coiltek ones (top). The painted cable showed its true nature when rubbed... the paint came off on my thumb! Real ones are a matte rubber... the fakes were somewhat glossy but had been painted with a matte black paint.

The level of sophistication with these CHINESE fakes is reaching new levels of deceit - what a disgrace. Almost impossible to tell from the real thing.....

I wouldn't risk buying off fleabay - Buy from your local supplier or through the reputable online Detecting stores

Thanks for highlighting this issue on Youtube nero

very informative Marco, can see why the flea bay trade in coils has dropped off now. They have taken some time to copies the coils and to be honest i woudnt have picked that as a fake.
The serial number and not sticking to one number is a good idea would make it very hard to catch them out until you had it in your hands.
Now like detectors i can see coils now being recorded to the buyer the only half decent way to keep track of the genuine ones, a receipt will not be enough anymore i recon.
Regards

.

excellent post!! top of the class Marco

That's a real wake up call,thank you so much I feel sorry for coiltek these people dont respect the time spent in research and development.The best thing we can do is make people aware and support our industry.

Thank you Marco for a good presentation and creating awareness.

We are fighting a battle at the moment trying to prevent these coils from being leeked into the market but there are some who have already been taken advantage of.

You can also see more on our website http://coiltekmanufacturing.com.au/counterfeitcoil.html

If you need clarification on a new purchase you can contact us however the main way to stop this activity is to buy from your local dealer.

It is very disturbing to me and everyone at Coiltek that this is happening.

Thankyou to all
Regards,
Trevor

They have been hawked around Melbourne for a few months now, there are three different lots from China and the last you wouuld not pick them. They were being sold as extra coils with a genuine SD 2000 series. Also on Ebay ,Trading post and the Net. This started from the African rush.
Some so called mate's have sold them to there Mates to off load them.
Genuine Coils at the moment are hard come by as most are on back orders.

What bastards....... no doubt they will only get more like the real ones. Pity about the legitimate ebay seller trying to sell an honest coil, eventually no one wil trust anybody.

Do they work BETTER then the real one ?????

NO THEY DO NOT WORK AS WELL. THEY DO WORK BUT IF YOU NEED A COIL GO TO A DEALER LIKE TONY MILLS IN DUNOLLY.

whatsthetime wrote:Do they work BETTER then the real one ?????

Mate........

Coiltek puts lots of good old Aussie effort in making their coils.

Have a look at Trevors COILTEK link and read the top paragraph http://coiltekmanufacturing.com.au/counterfeitcoil.html

From neros Youtube Video description

Remember that the Chinese (and Turkish) fakes are incapable of
functioning correctly on your Minelab detector. They barely penetrate
the ground, let alone highly mineralized soil, and may even fail to
provide circuit protection - potentially damaging your detector.


If you need a COILTEK Coil - buy one from your Local Authorized dealer that employs Australians and pays taxes - a coil made in Oz and support an AUSTRALIAN company that employs, supports Australia and Australians - that pays taxes etc etc.

Much rather that be disappointed and possibly destroy your expensive detector plus waste your hard earned mulla with a purchase of a dud inferior Chinee copy

Good advice hey

Regards

Thanks for the support everyone. This affects all manufacturers and all prospectors and remember that each of these fakes will probably keep getting resold as people discard them via varios methods when realizing they fail to perform. If a fake is used by someone and performs poorly to the unsuspecting user, it will impact on the company if word gets around that "Brand-X wasn't so good". In reality he might have been using a fake Brand-X so even one or two floating around causes problems for everyone.

whatsthetime wrote:Do they work BETTER then the real one ?????

Not at all. I've had a few people tell me that they have discovered the differences only when the fake wouldn't work (at all!) or when the coil caused the detector to react strangely or produce abnormal results and sounds.

Remember that person who advertised here on this very forum for a so-called "Coil Expert"? I suspect he was in the process of getting something illicit made. Several members of this forum (no names) sold coils to Chinese buyers in Hong Kong and I believe one of the buyers even admitted that he purchased the coil to replicate it. He didn't know until after the sale was concluded. The early Nugget Finder fakes and Minelab Fakes were very easy to spot... but now, all three major coil makers are the victims of Chinese counterfeits. They can, and will, eventually produce even more accurate versions that will not be discernible from the real thing other than by performance.

It take 12 days for mass replication to occur after an original has been obtained in mainland China.

Trevor, thanks for your reply... I have forwarded larger versions of the above images to you via Tony. Please feel free to use them in any way needed. I'll continue to obtain pictures of anything else that looks suspicious. On a related note, I saw some Nugget Finder coils recently but the guy wrapped them again and I was interrupted before I could take a picture. One was just a bizarre and crude thing made with a Dremmel and some resin, made to look like a 14" solid elliptical coil... but even the coil mounting bracket was cut from a solid slab of black resin and it still had the cut-marks on the surface as it had not been polished or coated... and the other looked very authentic at first glance but was alsmost certainly a counterfeit. The guy wouldn't believe me when I told him it was a fake. I pointed out that underneath the clear label was dirt trapped in the dimpled surface of the coil texture... and yet the logo decal looked brand new new. I haven't seen the counterfeit Minelab coils but they are also known to exist and also come from China as well as Turkey. Both of the companies producing those fakes were shipping them to Ireland, America and Australia to make it look like they'd come from the distributors there.

The coil of any detector is one of the most important parts of the machine. A failure to perform can be disenchanting and even costly or disastrous for the user. Any loss of revenue to any manufacturer will further undermine the hobby if it hampers or damages the company. The Chinese already want to obtain the 40 x 20" Coiltek drag-coils in this variation as well as the Coiltek 17 x 11" Wallaby type solids in the terracotta finish - so it looks like the counterfeits are probably to continue.

I own and also use coils from each of the manufacturers so I feel bad when I see these parasites from China do what they do.

One last thing: A detector coil counterfeit probably has the potential to cause serious problems for the owner if connected to a machine with a powerful battery like the GPX uses. Whilst I can't picture it causing a hazard, if it shorts the circuit, it would probably be an issue for the sensitive electronics. This is probably why the detector should not be powered on without a coil fitted.


.....

Good on ya trev,but I wish you would start that third shift,you might be surprised at the reduction of fake coils if production more closely matched orders,its a bit hard not to consider second hand and therefore fakes when you cant buy one for luv or money,mark

Good reaction guys, I just threw that line in because there was NO mention of them(fakes) actually WORKING........

Has the relevant govt. department or police been notified of these fakes ? Can the govt. even do anything about it ? It may come down to coiltek and NF having to put anti counterfeit measures like in our money to prevent these scumbags from doing this again.

I have been collecting Japanese swords for years now and about 8 years ago you would have seen about 100 hits on ebay for japanese sword. As of tonight, 7998 hits for Japanese sword and most of them are Chinese fakes. The sword community worldwide (very organised) got together and petitioned ebay and local authorities and guess what, nothing happened. The bastards are still out there churning them out and as time goes by they are getting better and better.


Chris.

bencld wrote:
I have been collecting Japanese swords for years now and about 8 years ago you would have seen about 100 hits on ebay for japanese sword. As of tonight, 7998 hits for Japanese sword and most of them are Chinese fakes. The sword community worldwide (very organised) got together and petitioned ebay and local authorities and guess what, nothing happened. The bastards are still out there churning them out and as time goes by they are getting better and better.


Chris.

Thats because ebay are their to make money, they couldn't give a ratz
arse.

Wow guys, when I typed the words "Fake Coil" into Google tonight, this thread is the first one on the resulting Google Search List. Good news for anyone curious and doing their own homework. I've spent the last few years dealing with Chinese forgeries of all sorts of products and pondering where it will lead. I thought the information below would be of interest to those members interested in forgeries from China - some of which touches on the detecting community. I hope you won't see this post as being off-topic or irrelevant. I find it interesting to read about and others seem to find it so as well.



TAINTED PRODUCTS:
Just like the fake milk exported from China that used a white powder normally utilized in painting walls to the recent "alert headlines" that Chinese workers making Apple iPhones were suffering seizures, paralysis and nerve damage from toxic chemicals (the factory was producing fakes and utilizing banned cleaning chemicals in the process). There's an ENDLESS supply and demand for fakes by people wanting to obtain the original items but at a lesser price. If the item is in short demand in the west (eg Coils etc), there's more than a dozen forgers willing to make a replacement which usually sells for a similar amount. For an endless account of Chinese fraud-inspired lawsuits relating to counterfeit products, have a look HERE!

China has been producing fake medicine (!!!) to the West found to contain cancer-causing chemicals, exporting fake Goat Meat (PORK!!) to Islamic countries, toxic drywall materials to the USA and poisonous pet food to Australia (which killed numerous cats and dogs because it contained toxic extender). Industrial bleach is being added to flour... and toxic industrial oils are being added to Rice. It's INSANE over there. To quote another blogger: "A recent search on the Web using keywords “Chinese milk lawsuit” in Chinese characters brought up 7,950,000 results".

But forgery and counterfeits have been around for a hundred thousand hears or more....Absynthe (that green liqueur popular in mid-1800s France) was in fact banned in many countries - but not because it was dangerous due to the Wormwood content, but because the fake Absinthe (made from distilled copper crystals to make it green like the real Absinthe) was killing people or destroying their brains. A harsh blight on the grape crop in France made it hard to maintain wine production and so Absinthe filled that void. As the popularity for Absinthe grew, so did the demand and a bootleg distillery set was soon to follow. Remind you of the detector coil trade?

I collect some types of Colonial coins (usually from the Americas) and the problems with Chinese fakes in that industry is ongoing and extremely problematic. They have an entire industry devoted towards manufacturing and aging coins. From modern to ancient. They even fake their own Chinese coins using inferior metal blanks. They'll employ hundreds of people at a factory and produce very convincing high grade fakes. They then age the coins via various methods to make them look more convincing - complete with fake patinas. Finally, they'll even slab the coins inside faked grading cases to give the impression that they have been authenticated by coin regulating bodies, complete with holograms and fake security seals on the slabs. Now certified coins in slabs are supposed represent security for those investing in expensive coins. When I've spotted fakes on Ebay, the seller claims to be innocent or suggests that it's up to the buyer to do his homework.


ONE OF THE MANY CHINESE COIN PRESSES USED TO MAKE COUNTERFEIT COINS


FAKE US MORGAN SILVER DOLLARS BEING PRODUCED IN A CHINESE FACTORY


FAKE COINS IN FAKE CERTIFICATION GRADING GUARANTEE SLABS - note the hologram


CHINESE FAKE DIES AND COIN STAMPS (note the Gold Sovereign STAMP). The red arrow points towards a current coin being produced... making this a modern forgery for a coin in current circulation.

Ebay of course do nothing although this forum pursued some scammers selling nuggets that were already in a private collection in the USA. The Sydney based scammer had downloaded the pictures from the internet and was "selling" these items which he did not actually have possession of. The range of fake fossils (some ending up in museums!) and designer products or electronics coming from China are simply staggering.

Bad news for the Detector Modders (LOL!) now as it appears a grassroots Chinese factory has started to offer to do the same for a fraction of the price - with more to follow as information becomes available. This is akin to a Mexican factory making cheaper fakes than the Chinese counterfeit company.


For comparison... This is an 1896 Silver Morgan Dollar that I found and later cleaned in Canada 2008. It is from the goldfields up near the Klondike, the last great Goldrush.

I can't see any immediate solution at the moment. Chinese culture considers counterfeit goods production as a legitimate business and there's nothing to stop them from selling their products outside their borders - usually via the internet. However, there is a story circulating at the moment that I believe may be true - which suggests that Chinese forgers (the same ones supposedly supplying some of the fake Minelab detectors) were executed in China after selling fake Mine Detection machines to the Chinese People's Army. If this is indeed true, it would suggest that the Chinese Government take a dim view of putting their own people at risk by fake detectors.

To the numerous coin collectors on this forum (and there's a few of you): The next time you consider buying an Ancient, Colonial or Modern coin on Ebay, you may want to consider the pictures posted above. The forgeries extend to every type of coin imaginable and the fakes are nearly impossible to determine beforehand. Try to buy from dealers you trust - the same goes for coils and detectors.

Fastgold, whilst I understand that you wish coil production to increase, perhaps part of the delay is the continual need for the coil manufacturers to produce further anti-replication methods to each aspect of assembly. Regardless, the reason there is even a market for the fakes is that many people buying them only want to sell them on for top dollar. Spare a thought for legitimate Sudanese buyers who are not on-selling them to make a quick profit, but want to use them personally with their own families to find gold near their villages (and there are many). Sure, they created this demand by paying stupid prices, but the greed of a lot of local eBayers and even overseas traders is what has driven up the price and created this vacuum that the Chinese counterfeiters thrive in.

It won't apply to this generation but some of the more obvious fake coils and machines may end up in museums in generations to come. Just as fake coins forged hundreds of years ago can be handsomely valued today by collectors.

.

Gday


Forged products have been coming out of asia forever, I remember as a kid when all the Japanese stuff started to flood the market, everyone called it "Jap Crap", they would copy anything and everything right down to the packaging, they started out the same way, and got better and better at it.

Nowadays we all love our Toyotas and Nissans dont we, they all started out from the same beginnings and I would bet that all the technology that went into them along the way was either begged,stolen or borrowed from all the other manufacturers who were about at the time.

In order for people to bother to produce counterfeit products there has to be an available market, right now the market for the coils is in Sudan, but as the market dries up and it will due to non performing coils, the makers of the coils are going to have to improve their quality and will be under pressure to produce correctly functioning coils, as it will become common practice to test before you buy, this is probably already happening as the fakes have been about for awhile now and many buyers would have been caught out and the word spreading far and wide.

The quality will have to improve if they want to keep selling their coils, and I believe it will and it will also get to a point where they could be preferred over the original purely by the fact that they are half the price and do the same job, buyers are price orientated more these days than ever before and will more often than not take the punt on a cheaper product if their is one available.

The reason I think that all of a sudden the fakes are turning up here and on ebay etc, is that the market they were intended for is drying up, and the forgers are trying to find different ways to get rid of them, the solution is simple if its too cheap or you have doubts dont but it, use you head and buy through a dealer, anyway if you have issues with it you can take it back, if you are buying a coil that is not that old through ebay etc, ask the seller if you can be sent a copy of the purchase reciept, if the coils new or not that old then they should have it, if they claim they dont then you should be suspicious and not buy it.


cheers


stayyerAU

Nero....Thankyou for the heads up and the pics....much appreciated by us all !!!!!!!!!!!

HueyDuck........

Nero,sorry but that old chestnut just doesnt wear. There are so many anti- theft devices around ie micro -chipping etc. As stated before ,if they can copy and basically have them in the market in 12 days what's that say for production in our our local market.May be the previous writer just might have it right. You only get what you put in and if you cant keep up the pace somebody will replace you and as stated prev those fakes will end up products of equal quality. Don't get me wrong in that I don't condone the theft of somebody's intellectual property,mark

Heres the supplier/ manufacturer out of china if anyone wants to persue them and stop their manufacturing mimmickery, surprisingly this company is noted as a reliable supplier of quality goods by several xport agencies out of china ,of course youd be foolish to believe many of these promotional agencies. SHANGHAI TIANXUN ELECTRONICS COMPANY LTD, of kangquiao industrial park shanghai, phone, [86-21]55324760, they make a variety of commander and coiltek coils as well as leads,etc. It appears these companies can make what they want without fear of being prosecuted however the importer and retailer here would be open to prosecution and civil action

It's a very sad situation for Australian coil producers. It could spell the end of coil manufacturing in Australia. A coil is a Fairly easy thing to make, they consist of wire , shielding and plastic, probably the hardest thing to make would be the housing. The Chinese have made the housing perfectly all that is left is to perfect the wiring side of things. If not already, it won't be long before they will be just as good as the original. As demand decreases the price of the copies will fall. As usual the Australian producers will never be able to compete. I don't want to be negative but it's probably the best time for Trevor to sell Coiltek.

BTW Nero, the Chinese are already making the 40x20 drag coil. they have a capacity of 500 units per month.

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/314731215/40_x_20_coils_for_GPX4500.html

Undertaker wrote:
BTW Nero, the Chinese are already making the 40x20 drag coil. they have a capacity of 500 units per month.

Well, a lot of the sellers on Alibaba don't have any stock to sell. They just claim they do in order to lock your money down. Almost all of them are fraudulent sellers in some way. They still advertise though... it's a bit like driftnet fishing. They wait for bulk orders and then they supply or simply cut ties and disappear with the money. Note that delivery is up to 10 days and I'll be they estimate shipping to you directly from the factory in this amount of time if the money paid is sufficient incentive.

Why else are the Chinese still trying to get samples of the 40x20 from Australian sellers as recently as mid-last week?

But you should ask yourself if they would they lie on Alibaba just to get sales for a non existent item? Here's a picture of a GPX being sold there recently: It actually says GPX-4500 on the box so perhaps it's legit:




Here's a picture of ANOTHER webpage there: ACTUAL AD PAGE

These scammers are using photographs stolen from the manufacturer's websites so again, there's little reason to trust their ads.

There's also a nice Minelab GP3500 here for sale - although it does resemble the E-Trac a bit: GP3500

.

just went thrue ebay so much fake

Hi Alexei and Nero,

You are correct. I was on ebay the other month and there was a Minelab 3500 on sale. The picture though had a photo of a 4500. I sent a message to ask is he selling a 3500 or a 4500, the answer came back very abrupt and he said he put up the wrong picture. How many machines or pictures does he have? Did not answer my questions, so I asked again. He sent me a message saying he made a mistake. Subsequently the listing was deleted. He was caught. How could you ever trust these people.

The other thing is that they cannot even write english, so they do not know what is going on.

Imagine sending them some hard earned cash - you would never see the item or your cash.
Stay Aaway from them. I would only buy from a detector shop. Acan

i am with you ! its very risky to by from them,
if you are after a second hand one (thats what i am looking for) mayb a good idea to visit a shop and ask deler if he know someone who will sell ( ppl do upgrade)

.

HEY GUYS HAVE A SUSS AT THIS WEBSITE GOT MY 3000 OFF A THEM, ALL THEY SELL IS SECOND HAND DETECTORS AND NOW COILS, ALL COME WITH A WARRANTY TOO, IN STH OZ, PLUS THEY ADVERTISE IN GG&T, www.detectabizz.vpweb.com.au. IM WITH YOU LOT ALWAYS BUY FROM A DEALER, CHEERS JUST MY 2 BOBS WORTH.

With all the controversy over fake coils....I have the perfect solution:
All Trevor has to do at Coiltek is what Pro Hart did on all his paintings in Broken Hill (because there were so many forgeries)...put some of his DNA on each one.............!
Just a thought.