Anybody used the ferrite ?

Alchemist,

I agree with Candy's remarks 100%. As a bulldozer guy I know how deep ground is (and isn't!) where I detect. Looking back at some of my posts on other forums I said precisely what Candy said - this machine is no good on shallow ground, you need deep dirt. But he also says that there will be small stuff missed by a 5000 still remaining. That must be a "given" if the 7000 is to perform as the advertising blurb goes. However, after two days of finding small stuff at depth mine just stopped finding anything at depth - on patches that I know intimately. So that's point one.

Point two -my depth testing results of my 7000 vs the 5000 reveals that there is no depth advantage of any significance. However, the publicising of these results is dependent on the report I get back from ML about my 7000. Suffice to say, that Candy's point about deep ground and deep gold can't be substantiated with MY machine.

Consider - ML must have done some "pre-fabricated" testing "in ground" or "in-lab" order to produce the claims they make regarding depth and sensitivity. So I think we can safely say that my (or any other) "pre-fabricated" test pad is an acceptable test method and just as revealing. Using existing targets that are milions of years old is not the same as "pre-fabricated" testing, but that dissimilarity cuts both ways. One is a "known" and the other is an "unknown" until dug and measured.

ML can't escape this by hiding behind the "halo effect" or any other reason. A standard test method for machines that are "side by side" on test is the revealing method. You can't have one test for one machine and another test system for the other. That's unfair.

G'day Les

I hope you get sorted with the machine and the new techniques needed to get the machine going along good.

I have now used the "Ferrite" and it does make a big difference in the ground I am working, I was blaming the machine for everything when in fact it was a combination of several thing acting against me and the machine at the same time which was giving me an inconsistent and bad experience.

The Ferrite won't totally fix the problem in bad ground but it certainly helps. Bad ground is what is being called "salty" which is in fact "Alkaline" ground and not what I had in mind as salty ground, I thought of salty ground the same as everyone else.

I have been given some very good advise on how to use the ferrite and overcome to a big degree the effect of this alkaline ground to the point where I can now detect without the insane frustration I was experiencing.

This is how, use the ferrite like in the instructions and video at startup and make sure the detector is not responding to the ferrite with a signal when you have started detecting just by placing the ferrite back on the ground and swinging over it without touching the quick button, if this is all good then go to manual ground balance (the old fixed GB) and swing over the ferrite again without touching the quick track button, if all is good leave the machine in manual GB and keep detecting the bad alkaline ground, yes you will still get the confined small spots that are extra bad but overall it is way better than before.

To check the GB just raise and lower coil a few inches (like with the previous machines) without touching the quick track button and listen for out of balance noise. After doing this while detecting in manual GB the and the machine seems a bit out of GB just place the ferrite on the ground and swing over it without touching the quick track button and see if there is a signal from the ferrite, if no signal from ferrite, just do a quick ground balance by holding in the quick track for a couple of seconds and a side to side swing away from the ferrite, let the quick button go and recheck over the ferrite and keep detecting.

It's a bit more of a manual method than just using auto GB but certainly helps to keep the detector under control in the alkaline noisy wah wah type ground.

cheers dave

Thanks for that post Dave. Really helpful. Ill def use that method when i get my faulty coil, WM-12 and 12v charger lead back from ML!!

Dave,

Thanks for the detailed "how to do it". I haven't got my ferrite ring yet - I think it went to my PO Box in Leonora by mistake - and my 7000 is still with Minelab. When all is back to normal I'll be back in Leo on the test patch.

"Alchemist" and that "5 cent coin at 18 inches" has me gobsmacked to be honest. I can't get anywhere near that on such a small target!!

davsgold wrote:The Ferrite won't totally fix the problem in bad ground but it certainly helps.  Bad ground is what is being called "salty" which is in fact "Alkaline" ground and not what I had in mind as salty ground, I thought of salty ground the same as everyone else.

cheers dave  

Dave this is  a BIG question but I know you have the Guts to answer  

After you use the ferrite to GB  the 7000 on Alkaline ground is it now dumed down = less performance ?   would you be  better off using your 4500 in those areas ?

Jack

Jack outwest wrote:Dave this is  a BIG question but I know you have the Guts to answer  

After you use the ferrite to GB  the 7000 on Alkaline ground is it now dumed down = less performance ?   would you be  better off using your 4500 in those areas ?

Jack

G'day Jack

That's a very good question mate, and I am surprised and happy with what I found happens.

I found the ferrite actually enhances performance, believe it or not. This is what I have been noticing before I had the ferrite, the detector even though it was "Noisy" I was still finding small gold and some at reasonable depths, but after the nugget was removed from the ground it had a reduced signal (air testing the same nugget) was less in air than when in the ground, I was surprised by this and found it hard to understand.

Now doing the same air test on the same nugget after using the ferrite the air test was better, as the nugget could be picked up at a distance a bit greater than when in the ground, which is what I was expecting before the ferrite.

So in summary I think so far the ferrite is a big advantage, it helps with keeping the detector GB under reasonable control on the alkaline type ground and it seems so far the targets are a better response than before, which stands to reason, if the GB is better on any detector the easier it is to get a good target response and to actually hear the target.

I am quite confident that after the advice given and some practice using the ferrite the results have improved, and the mentally draining fatigue of trying to use a machine that was misbehaving is looking like a thing of the past.

I am not knowing how the ferrite will be in good quiet ground but sometime I hope to get onto such ground and then will know the answer to this as well.

cheers dave

Thanks Dave for your input , it's a  worry when someone with your experience has hassles with this unit .
Hey''' Minelab make them  in Australia again  

  Still can't fathom how a ML unit that costs $10,700 needs feffite help to GB on Aussie ground

jack .

Thanks Dave for your thoughts, very helpful, and Jack for asking more pertinent questions.

I've also noticed a much better range on many undisturbed targets. I suspected that the 7 was utilising the duricrust minerals somehow to aid field transmission.
But going by what you say it may simply be anomalous GB between air/ground/undisturbed ground.

It will be interesting to do a test bed with the ferrite in the mix, results may make more sense then.
I would expect that quite a number of test nuggets found with a 7 will give much lesser ranges on the GPX, but using those found by a GPX will give about equal to slightly better range on the 7.    

Cheers.

I know not what the ferrite does on/for salt soils,but I do know that if one puts a magnet to the ferrite,will find that the ferrite,is quite magnetic.
Now by ground balancing over the ferrite,over ground found to be high in magnetite (ground containing percentages of highly conductive magnetic soils /hot rocks),will greatly reduce falsing over such signals,with minimal,if any loss,in terms of sensitivity or depth to positive targets.
The ferrite does reduce ground noise to some degree over a majority of ground conditions mentioned above,but keep in mind,not all ground consists of high percentages of magnetite.
On benign soils,(soils containing very low percentages of conductive/ferritic materials,the ferrite would have little if no effect at all,towards a smooth,stable,quiet running detector.

Cheers Kon.

Yes Kon, the ferrite is attracted to a magnet, just the same as some Ironstone hot rocks are attracted to a magnet, but the ferrite is not a magnet itself, with some more use with the ferrite it will become clearer how well it's helping in various ground types.

cheers dave

You nailed it with this comment, Dave:

",,,,,,the mentally draining fatigue of trying to use a machine,,,,,"

Apart from the first cuppla days, that's exactly how I felt when I using my 7000 - exhausted, uncertain and angry. Hardly a pleasant day's detecting.

I had the ferrite with me on the weekend, I tried it, but the machine was running so smooth anyway, there was no way to hear it make a difference. It obviously only has to be used when you can't quiet down the machine the normal way. It doesn't weigh anything, so you've got nothing to lose by keeping it on you for those extreme conditions.

slimpickens wrote:I had the ferrite with me on the weekend, I tried it, but the machine was running so smooth anyway, there was no way to hear it make a difference. It obviously only has to be used when you can't quiet down the machine the normal way. It doesn't weigh anything, so you've got nothing to lose by keeping it on you for those extreme conditions.

G'day Harry

Once you have done the initial walk swing thing at startup just try this, place the ferrite on the ground, and without touching the quick track button, swing over the ferrite at detecting height and normal detecting sweep speed, if the detector makes no signal at all on the ferrite all is good, it just means the ground your working has enough ferrite in it to keep the detector happy, if you get a slight to loud signal when you do this it means the detector needs the ferrite ring provided to get what it needs to keep it happy.

Try the same thing after a reset and see what happens. Do all of the above in that order after the reset.

cheers dave

Thanks Dave, I'll give it a try

Hey where can I get one of these ferries ??? From the local pet shop, and how do you hold it still to ground balance on.... lol, nah but seriously could this ferrite be used on an earlier machine like a gpx 400 foR GB on difficult ground
Cheers mike

bonacini wrote:Hey where can I get one of these ferries ??? From the local pet shop, and how do you hold it still to ground balance on....  lol, nah but seriously could this ferrite be used on an earlier machine like a gpx 400 foR GB on difficult ground
Cheers mike

It's no real benefit to the previous machines, the ground balance on the 7000 v the 5000 is a completely different setup.

cheers dave

davsgold wrote:

bonacini wrote:Hey where can I get one of these ferries ??? From the local pet shop, and how do you hold it still to ground balance on....  lol, nah but seriously could this ferrite be used on an earlier machine like a gpx 400 foR GB on difficult ground
Cheers mike

It's no real benefit to the previous machines, the ground balance on the 7000 v the 5000 is a completely different setup.

cheers dave

Yeah to that Dave,,,,,,,,,,,it seems one works and the other doesn't.

Still waiting,,,,,,,,,,,,it must be terminal,,,,,,,,,,,,