The GPZ7000 intro video what am I really seeing?

We'll watching this video tells me a couple of things from the bar graph;
1/ The 7000 goes up to 10% deeper on gold under 5g than the 2300.Quote"The GPZ7000 clearly outperforms the other detectors,with a significant depth improvement over GPX on small gold nuggets"
2/ The 7000 goes up to 25% deeper on gold over 100g(3.3oz) than the 5000 with a 15"x12"
3/ The 2300 goes up to 25% deeper on gold under 5g than the 5000.
4/ The 5000 with the 15"x12" goes 15% deeper than the baseline 5000 test.
5/ In the 10-50g range the 7000 was up to 30% deeper than the 5000.
6/ The baseline coil used on the 5000 was the 11"mono giving the "Up to 40% depth improvement"
7/ The bar graph is not a true representation of the comparison as it only goes to -30% and not -100% for the 5000 baseline.This gives a visual  impression of nearly double depth of the 7000 over the 5000.
The recommended mode is high yield.This covers 0.1-50g.

I'm thinking that the 2300 for very small gold and 5000 with large mono's will still have their place in our detecting kits.If the 15"x12" was used on the 5000 for the 10-50g range tests the results may have been significantly less for the 7000.There is a lot of small gold out there under a gram and a good test would have been a comparison with the 2300 under a gram.

Hi Deutran,
Everyone seems to be assuming that the 15x12 coil on the 5000 in the test video is a mono but I haven't seen anything to actually confirm that. Perhaps I missed something or perhaps it was a simple omission on minelabs part but it would be good to know for sure if its a mono or DD so we can be sure what we are comparing to. i know that they confirmed the 11"was a mono but just said 15x12 for the other coil - would make a big difference.

Hi Shandeemax
I rechecked the video and it looks like a mono cable as their putting it on,good point though we tend to forget about the DD's.

The fine print on the brocure says it's a mono, but how you compare this with a DOD is not so clear. I expect the 20" coil will really turn heads.
Cheers  

I see what you are saying Steve, people looking at the chart could think it goes double the depth.    This rough chart is closer to a true representation of the depth comparrisions
If you can get a 0.1er at 5" with a 2300 you`ll get it at 6" with the 7000
If you can get a 5 grammer at 10" with the 5000 you`ll get it at 14" with the 7000
At the other end of the scale, if you can get a  3 ouncer at 20" with a 5000 you`re gunna get it at 28" with the 7000
I`m still thinking for people that own a 2300 general or deep timings will be the go
cheers dave

Hi Steve,

I agree. A GPX 4500/5000 (with a larger coil) and the SDC 2300 are not really going to miss very much. The GPZ 7000 data is well presented – however the actual information is very limited. For example, it may have been more meaningful to everyone if the presented information compared the GPZ 7000 14 inch D coil with a 4500/5000 + mono 14 inch round coil (i.e. comparing apples with apples). Perhaps in mineralised ground there may be some overall advantages? I think it would be a cautious purchase at this point of time - particularly given the estimated cost vs benefits? I guess the actual performance of the GPZ 7000 will be revealed in the not too distant future.

Cheers De

I wonder if some of Minelabs' sales and advertising department are ex car salesmen?
Pretty misleading graphics all right.

quote "The information displayed in this graph is an out-of-the-box comparison, is indicative only," unquote

indicative of embellishment that's what that is. Why try to make it look better if they really believe in the product?
Shame.

My opinion is there are other benefits to the Zed than just raw depth. Ability to handle atmospheric noise, ground mineralization, ground balancing. newer electronics, smaller less congested form factor, wireless!, quicker tuning, ground balance... etc etc.

I find it difficult to blindly accept the Minelab tests, however, I have yet to see a backwards step in technology.

Minelab make amazing machines. Upgrade if YOU CHOOSE.

IGotBigNuggets wrote:
 
Minelab make amazing machines.  Upgrade if YOU CHOOSE.

True, but why misrepresent data to appear better?

You are spot on with the other points, and Minelab should've focused more on these, a couple more, nuggets with ground like decays now less likely to hide from the Zeds new timings. DOD coil having juxtaposed Rx pattern, looking in from 2 angles, incident to eddy responses and not the Tx ......etc., ad in

Cheers.

alchemist wrote:

IGotBigNuggets wrote:
 
Minelab make amazing machines.  Upgrade if YOU CHOOSE.

True, but why misrepresent data to appear better?

You are spot on with the other points, and Minelab should've focused more on these, such as nuggets with ground like decays now less likely to hide from the Zeds new timings. DOD coil having juxtaposed Rx pattern, looking in from 2 angles, incident to eddy responses and not the Tx ......etc., ad in

Cheers.

Simply put, this is sales marketing.

Extreme Depth is the seed of doubt that Minelab plant into the owners minds of current machines.

The owners (all of us) then question whether they are missing out on gold by not having the deepest seeking machine. But again that is just sales marketing.

Hi Steve, l found the depth test interesting to say the least. Was it a fair test with a foot of top soil and a gaping big hole underneath? I would bet anything on my 5000 in normal and my 12.5 rd detech coil would pick up that 21 oz nugget at that depth without that gaping hole. And with that hole not a problem, using myv18" NF it would sing out. Time will tell what real depth we can get but found test not to be very accurate. My thoughts . Pap

This is from the sales Brochure

“I managed to find some decent gold at depth, including a 2 ½ ounce nugget
at over 2 ½ feet. A GPX 5000 with a 20-inch Monoloop
couldn’t even touch it.”

Now if there is anyone out there that is able to dial the 5000 to its full potential it would have to be JP wouldnt it ?
If the Z was able to find a 2.5oz at 2.5ft assuming that the target was still in the ground when both machines were tested over it, goes to show how much deeper the Z actually goes against the 5000 mounted with a 20" coil at that, The 20" coil might well reached that depth as well in the right conditions however this straight away shows the Z's ability to totally ignore the ground altogether picking up targets not seen by the 5000

Makes sense right ?

Marty

Martin R wrote:This is from the sales Brochure

“I managed to find some decent gold at depth, including a 2 ½ ounce nugget
at over 2 ½ feet. A GPX 5000 with a 20-inch Monoloop
couldn’t even touch it.”

Now if there is anyone out there that is able to dial the 5000 to its full potential it would have to be JP wouldnt it ?
If the Z was able to find a 2.5oz at 2.5ft assuming that the target was still in the ground when both machines were tested over it, goes to show how much deeper the Z actually goes against the 5000 mounted with a 20" coil at that, The 20" coil might well reached that depth as well in the right conditions however this straight away shows the Z's ability to totally ignore the ground altogether picking up targets not seen by the 5000

Makes sense right ?

Marty

That 2 1/2 oz nugget, wasn't that dug up in USA by Steve H.?
So in saying that, the ground there is much more different to OZ ground.?

Thanks dave for doing the bar graph thats exactly what I was after I just couldn't do it myself.One thing that appears very promising with the 7000 in high yield is the range that it covers 0.1-50g.This means you won't need to switch over to a different mode for most detecting.I can see the limitation of the 2300 in this regard that we've had to reach for our 5000's.
Thanks De for mentioning the comparisons its very hard to compare a DOD coil with anything else its a whole new technology.

UNCLE BOB wrote:
That 2 1/2 oz nugget, wasn't that dug up in USA by Steve H.?
So in saying that, the ground there is much more different to OZ ground.?

Its directly under JP's side of the Brochure
http://www.minelab.com/__files/f/261752/4907-0796-1%20GPZ%207000%20Brochure%20US%20English%20%28FULL%208P%29%20WEB.pdf

Marty

AND...what were the 5000 settings, was it in NORMAL or FINE GOLD, makes a big difference on large deep targets.

Read the reply up a little where I said

""Now if there is anyone out there that is able to dial the 5000 to its full potential it would have to be JP wouldnt it ?""

So I'd say the setting were at the max for the 5000

Marty

There are to many variables at play here to make assumptions.The only real test will be out in the field.For example that huge gap under the soil could be likened to doing an air test which means squat and doesn't allow for the halo effect of a buried target either.

The Z is not reading the Halo effect , Its reading the dying down of the eddie currents , see vid were Bruce explains it , They I see it its not looking for the nugget but the dying eddie currents as the coil passes over it unlike a 5000 where multi pulses are being punched down to located a target and the reflected beam heads back up to the coil

Hope I got that right LOL

Marty

lts beginning to sound like star wars.Maybe dark vader can explain.

Martin R wrote: Its reading the dying down of the eddie currents

All the ML PI machines since the first SD work this way

Interesting to note the way the guy in the vid performed a Quick Track.

No pumping of the coil.

Narrawa wrote:Interesting to note the way the guy in the vid performed a Quick Track.

No pumping of the coil.

Yeah, it really shows how this is definitely a totally new platform.

I've altered the graphic to more honestly show the other two tests.

Really the only one with any merit is the last one where the Zed is compared with the 5K with coils of similar volume. The true depth advantage in their test situation was up to 22%. Now that's still darn good, at 20" that's extended to 24.3"

The centre test is pointless, and so is the first one.There's a hell of a lot of difference between a 0.1 and a 5g, and the Zed should've been using the 11" on the tiddlers. Will a 2300 really get a 5g 20% deeper than a 5K?

Now in the states Doc said he saw a 200% advantage in a test over there, can't wait to get the details of that, was he just blowing or what?

Cheers

A mate of mine hit a 22 oz piece at around a metre with his 5000 and a 16" NFA! It went absolutely THUMP when he waved over it!
The true depth comparisons with big deep gold will come when the like for like tests are carried out with maxed out settings and big coils (5000 v 7000)
It's certainly stuff worth waiting for I tell ya!

BG

The real comparisons will be when your finding regular gold on areas you have found gold before because it is you who has the knowledge of average depth and size for that area and will be able to tell if the 7000 is finding gold you missed and at better depths.

The other test will be if it is finding smaller gold at depths that you know your older detector would not have found at that depth unless it was a much larger bit.

Logic & common sense fellas. You'll know how good the GPZ is the moment you'v gone back to a couple of your old flogged to death gold patches.If it can pull out several other bits of gold (not just the one piece that you might have missed) will be a true indication of its performance capabilities.
Some of us will know within the next few weeks.

Cheers Kon.

You yourself will be the best tester and judge.

What I'm seeing is that the 14" coil is being compared to an 8" coil on the SDC yet still goes deeper on smaller nuggets. If that's the case then I sure would like to slap an 8" coil on the GPZ and see how much deeper it goes on a half grammar.

Hi Au
Now wouldn't that be something,the gpz with an 8" coil on small gold.

Alchemist, i liked your graph. I have been wondering about different senarios and we will not know till released, but we have/know of a few spots where there is lots of small gold ie .2 to .8 gram and cannot get it unless you scrap 2" off the surface. We know this as we did lots of raking but that is hard work.  Am hoping this new machine will get that extra depth without the raking. Using a good 4500   TG