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Post  PeterInSa Fri Dec 04, 2020 5:52 pm

Since I purchased the Z with its Swing Arm ( I think Reg Wilson calls them a cripple stick) each sweep of the coil takes around 4 secs. To me this is OK in Vic and Tibooburra where mostly the ground has been well done over, but in WA its not a good patch finding technique and not my method of detecting when I had the ML 4500 with coils from a 24" Elliptical down to a 6" elliptical with various swing speeds to suit the location.

Maybe on our next visit to WA I should be using SWMBO's Backup 4500 (to her 2300) as a patch finder, then use the Z when the first piece of gold is found. Read on this or another forum thats what a Z owner is doing with his GM.

If I did not need the swing arm ( but I've got use to it), maybe I could swing faster for patch finding, like a mate who does not need the bungee or the swing arm for his Z, just a one arm sweep..

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Post  Kon61gold Sat Dec 05, 2020 12:48 am

G'day Pete

What, no swing arm nor bungee cord when swinging the GPZ Shocked A constant one arm sweep? Shocked Not that it can't be done Pete, but for how long? There's no playing cowboy in this game chum. Swinging or persevering to swing the GPZ with its standard 14X13 coil on without the use of a bungee cord or swingarm attached, so that ones shoulder/back are more evenly supported, is asking for major shoulder, lower back, or hip problems down the track.
We or most of us who have swung a GPZ, know that its the heaviest tank of a PI, built by Minelab. You'd think in an age of micro circuitry, they could have made a GPZ 7000 at half the current weight.  I can only hope the future GPX 6000 is far more refined weight wise, than it's heavy sibling.
My advice to you (& very important for anyone upon first acquiring the Z) is to forget about what you were comfortably use to using & get use to using the Z as often as you can, in order to gain as much information/knowledge of what the Z's telling you (over various gold bearing type ground conditions, targeting different type/size targets), so that you can get a much better understanding of the Z, before chopping & changing from one detector to the next.
The GPZ 7000 has enough settings/timings/gold modes etc, to cover just about every ground type, gold type/size, one could ever encounter out on a gold field (within the detectors limits/capabilities of course) & it is these settings/gold modes you should be playing around with or chopping/changing from, in order to get the best out of the Z's performance, over the type of ground you intend on searching in/on & or the type/size gold you are chasing.
There is no one set rule or formula for the swing speed of a coil, for there are one to many in ground & gold type variables involved.  Not taking into account ones preferred coil swing speed, the type of ground, type of detector & or size/type of coil used, over a particular type/size target, basically tends to govern the swing speed of a coil.
Then again, the above information is not gospel, but my personal opinion only & what best suits me, might not suit another.

Cheers Kon. T25
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Post  hoolahoopa Sat Dec 05, 2020 2:05 am

Peter there is a lot of people doing exactly what you have thought about.
Find the patch with the 4500 clean it up with the z.
It is not a patch finder at all in my opinion.
Of interest in Kalgoorlie the last couple of big patches have been found with the 4500 the z has not been able to cope with the ground.

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Post  PeterInSa Sat Dec 05, 2020 6:22 am

Re (It is not a patch finder at all in my opinion)
Re WA Patch finding, Mate swings his 4500 faster with a 17x13 coil than myself back in my 45 days, SWMBO with her 2300 is faster than my Z and mates wife (2300)is slower than my Z but does not miss any gold she comes by. I remember as a kid, my dad saying to me " Fish where the Fish are" so we need to cover the area to find the fish (gold).

Kon re (What, no swing arm nor bungee cord when swinging the GPZ Shocked A constant one arm sweep? Shocked Not that it can't be done Pete, but for how long) Agree, was a few years ago but cannot recall seeing the bungee or the SA in a month detecting with him, but if you have big arm muscles and the coil in on the ground the effort is only in sliding the coil across the ground.

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Post  PeterInSa Sat Dec 05, 2020 1:04 pm

Found just now its not only my swing speed with the Z its my hearing.... Getting old is a Bummer.

Grand daughter drops in for a talk and asks me whats that outside our front door 4m away that's making a noise, goes out and shows me our Cat Repeller, looks like 2 eyes are watching the Front door with a red Led Light nose. I cannot hear anything, she gets out her phone, records it, magnifies it and I can hear White noise. (Cat previously peed on our Front door security screen)


https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2021-Solar-Power-Dog-Cat-Repeller-Ultrasonic-Sensor-Pest-Scarer-Deterrent-Garden/333724226217?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D20160908110712%26meid%3D5292b4343eb743b9ad598488ee88d1c1%26pid%3D100677%26rk%3D6%26rkt%3D30%26mehot%3Dnone%26sd%3D373090609546%26itm%3D333724226217%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2386202%26algv%3DDefaultOrganic%26brand%3DUnbranded&_trksid=p2386202.c100677.m4598

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Post  peterinaust Sat Dec 05, 2020 1:16 pm

My hearing is starting to drop on high pitch sounds in the right ear. We have a cat repeller I can't hear it, and nobody else has said anything, it does work.

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Post  AraratGold Sat Dec 05, 2020 1:18 pm

hoolahoopa wrote:Peter there is a lot of people doing exactly what you have thought about.
Find the patch with the 4500 clean it up with the z.
It is not a patch finder at all in my opinion.
Of interest in Kalgoorlie the last couple of big patches have been found with the 4500 the z has not been able to cope with the ground.

My last two big patches in WA have both been found with the ZED.
It is a great patch hunting machine, if you know how to use it. This season with the addition of a 17 inch X Coil it was even better.
I only use the ZED, my wife uses a 4500 N/F 17 EVO.
There are plenty of people in WA finding patches with the ZED !
PS : I have not found anywhere in WA yet that the ZED can not cope with the ground. It is all about using the available options, including locate patch mode and salt mode. With the last two options I have been able to use NORMAL in a lot more areas.

Rick
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Post  Kon61gold Sat Dec 05, 2020 1:48 pm

Pete, like I said at the end of my comments, what works for me might not suit another, but swinging a GPZ 7000 with one arm without the use of the bungee cord or swing arm, will over a course of time, place un-even stress on individual bodily parts, regardless of the size of ones biceps. Mind you anything can be achieved if one insists on persevering by using the same technique, but again for how long? The GPZ is a heavy detector & regardless of arm size, even dragging the coil on the ground (from left to right) for prolonged periods of time, will take it out on ones wrist/shoulder. Now I'm only stating what I've felt, by trying to do the same thing much earlier on upon acquiring the Z, but the stress/pain felt on shoulder/wrist were just to much for me within an hr of swing time, not alone 4/5hrs straight use.
Anyways & like said not suited for me, but if one is more than capable of doing so (a days detecting using a GPZ 7000 with one arm & no bungee or swing arm attached) by all means good on them.
Unfortunately hearing from prolonged detector use via head phones over the years, does have its consequences & even I have experienced a loss of hearing to some degree, over the years of constant detector use. Same would apply to people who listen to loud music in their cars, driving to or from work every day. It all catches up with one over time.

Cheers Kon. T25
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Post  PeterInSa Sat Dec 05, 2020 2:23 pm

Re (There are plenty of people in WA finding patches with the ZED !)

Do not disagree. However with myself in the same location, it would take longer since my swing speed with the Z/swing arm is less than the swing speed with the 4500, and unfortunately I am nor prepared to change it..

And of course the more time you have in WA eg a friend with a Z in some prior years, has Autumn, Winter and Spring.... the more ground cover, the more chaining, the more patches.

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Post  AraratGold Sat Dec 05, 2020 2:31 pm

PeterInSa wrote:Re (There are plenty of people in WA finding patches with the ZED !)

Do not disagree. However with myself in the same location, it would take longer since my swing speed with the Z/swing arm is less than the swing speed with the 4500, and unfortunately I am nor prepared to change it..

And of course the more time you have in WA eg a friend with a Z in some prior years, has Autumn, Winter and Spring.... the more ground cover, the more chaining, the more patches.

Peter,

Perhaps you could try upping your swing speed just for patch hunting. I can easily cover 5km in a 4 hour morning patch hunting, and yes, I use the swing arm and bungy.

Try doing some testing over buried targets and you will be surprised at just how fast you can swing the ZED and get those targets. You may miss some deep targets, but that is not what patch hunting is all about. It is about covering as much ground in as short a possible time and pinging that first nugget. Then you slow down, and chain if possible.

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Post  moredeep Sat Dec 05, 2020 3:37 pm

I always tell the story of when my good coil broke when I was in WA.
I stormed back to the car with the 5000 ,put on my old crappy 11" mono and stormed off in another direction to the others.
I swung like a mad man at breakneck speed just to burn of some frustrations.
5 minutes later ping! a 13 gm sunbaker,that was the start of a 3oz patch.
go hard and go fast Laughing Laughing Laughing if it's meant to be,it's meant to be cheers


cheers   moredeep
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Post  davsgold Sat Dec 05, 2020 3:51 pm

Hey moredeep, I just notice the number of post you have done better change that quick. Laughing

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Post  moredeep Sat Dec 05, 2020 6:56 pm

What a Face affraid affraid affraid affraid affraid affraid affraid affraid affraid affraid affraid affraid Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
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Post  moredeep Sat Dec 05, 2020 6:57 pm

thanks dave cheers


cheers   moredeep
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Post  moredeep Sat Dec 05, 2020 6:59 pm

one more,had to get off 9[13] Laughing
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Post  hoolahoopa Sun Dec 06, 2020 1:20 am

go hard and go fast Laughing Laughing Laughing if it's meant to be,it's meant to be cheers
Yep that's the trick!👍

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Post  gim Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:34 pm

Hi Peter, have a look on youtube there may be a few videos you may be able to pick up a few hints from. Very Happy

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Post  PeterInSa Mon Dec 07, 2020 10:40 pm

Re ( I can easily cover 5km in a 4 hour morning patch hunting,)

Mentioned this to a friend tonight, he is slow like myself, maybe a bit faster, but like myself, he was surprised at AG's ground coverage, who has definitely runs on the board re patches.

And its not just the swing speed its the experience/hearing in picking up the small whispers signals/nuggets during the faster swing.

Its about 21m a minute by my Calculation( maths are not one of my strong points) 5000/240 = 20.8,

Without the swing arm, I think I would be a lot faster with the Z, for patch finding, but not as fast as the lighter 4500 with no swing arm.

and Re (Hi Peter, have a look on youtube there may be a few videos you may be able to pick up a few hints from.)

Had this swing ever since the purchase of the Z years ago.. Its like teaching an old dog new tricks, especially to me the slow swing is still needed in Vic, SA and Tibooburra..

Anyway I realize I need to up the tempo in WA so will try to put AG's advice into practice next year.


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