The 2023 state of the climate report: Entering uncharted territory

planetcare wrote:

granite2 wrote:I reiterate, Albo and Bowen are so much smarter than the governments of 34 other countries and their CSIRO equivalents

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/edf-says-hinkley-point-start-now-june-2027-costs-rise-2022-05-19/

Many of these 34 countries do not have the enormous solar and wind potential of Australia! We do not need nuclear in Australia!

You never give up, do you?

Gents, I don't ever recall government asking the general public for permission of what best action to take, on be it climate change or what ever else comes to mind, for our government will do what ever they believe to be the right course of action, even if that right course of action is wrong. So really no point in trying to determine what course of action the government of the day will take for it's all in their hands.
Why place so much effort towards which way the winds going to blow from day to day, when government themselves can't determine what right course of action to take, from one day to the next?
When our government decided to terminate the diesel powered submarine deal from France & cost the tax payer close to a billion dollar's, did they need or ask for the general publics opinion or approval? Or when our government cancelled the Commonwealth games & lost another 400 million in doing so, did they ask for or need our approval? When our public hospital systems were screaming for a couple of 100 million dollars in funds, so as to cut the long waiting times for people, they kept saying that's too much for the budget is already in deficit, yet they managed to pull a trillion dollars out of the tax payers kitty, in order to handle this covid-19 saga, I don't recall government ever asking the general public of what they could or should do.
Government will do whatever they deem to be right on the day, without public opinion involved.
This is why I say you're only going round in circles debating what's not in our hands to decide.

Kon

This indicates that Nuclear power is too expensive (written by anti nuke persons). and pastes a grim outlook for atomic energy.

https://reneweconomy.com.au/in-2022-nuclear-powers-future-is-grimmer-than-ever/

It is interesting that in order for our solar power stations to operate correctly we need a massive 1.4 million km diameter raging ball of fire and nuclear energy burning at 150,000,000 km distance out in space while bombarding the planet with unending atomic radiation that causes heart attacks, cancer, blood disorders etc. Hardly true clean safe energy aye?

As for wind power:
Good luck with that people; You wouldn't want your life to be depending on it for reliability.

Well I don't know about anyone else but I cannot bring myself to worry about climate change. There's nothing I can say of that will change things. But I would like to be still around in fifty years so I can tell all those who doubt me, I TOLD YOU SO

It's not global warming this time, but global freezing. Nonetheless, the climate scientist is still the bad guy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QW-NFkVDfdA

granite2 wrote:Well I don't know about anyone else but I cannot bring myself to worry about climate change. There's nothing I can say of that will change things. But I would like to be still around in fifty years so I can tell all those who doubt me, I TOLD YOU SO

You do not need to wait 50 years,the effects of anthropogenic climate change are already here!!!!

If you say so, pebbles

If you say so PC

granite2 wrote:If you say so PC

Look at the evidence!!!!! the planet is warming and that warming is NOT natural climate variation!!!!

planetcare wrote:

granite2 wrote:If you say so PC

Look at the evidence!!!!!  the planet is warming and that warming is NOT natural  climate variation!!!!

https://news.climate.columbia.edu/2017/04/04/how-we-know-climate-change-is-not-natural/
https://www.epa.gov/climatechange-science/causes-climate-change

There is none so blind as he who will not see.

Pebbles wrote:There is none so blind as he who will not see.

Please show us any evidence you have that anthropogenic global warming is NOT occurring!!!

[quote="planetcare"]

planetcare wrote:

granite2 wrote:If you say so PC

Look at the evidence!!!!!  the planet is warming and that warming is NOT natural  climate variation!!!!

Adrian ss:
Quote

Yes it is:
What else can have happened to cause the planets glaciers, ice and snow fields to begin melting 12,000 years ago?
Prior to the Industrial revolution this melting was already accelerating. If not due to natural cyclical events then what Huh! Go on, What then . What, What ,What!! I want proof, scientific proof. Nothing is true or real without proof.

Planetcare, my post was not directed at you.  It just happened that it appeared immediately following yours.

On issues WRT climate change, I am in total accord with your views.

adrian ss wrote:

planetcare wrote:

planetcare wrote:

granite2 wrote:If you say so PC

Look at the evidence!!!!!  the planet is warming and that warming is NOT natural  climate variation!!!!

Adrian ss:
Quote

Yes it is:
What else can have happened to cause the planets glaciers, ice and snow fields to begin melting 12,000 years ago?
Prior to the Industrial revolution this melting was already accelerating. If not due to natural cyclical events then what Huh! Go on, What then . What, What ,What!!  I want proof, scientific proof. Nothing is true or real without proof.  

Adrian where is your evidence for this ? publications ? perhaps you might try to rebut the evidence in the following links!
Scientific Consensus: Earth's Climate Is Warming
https://climate.nasa.gov/scientific_consensus/
https://royalsociety.org/topics-policy/projects/climate-change-evidence-causes/
https://royalsociety.org/topics-policy/projects/climate-change-evidence-causes/question-1/

planetcare wrote:

granite2 wrote:Well I don't know about anyone else but I cannot bring myself to worry about climate change. There's nothing I can say of that will change things. But I would like to be still around in fifty years so I can tell all those who doubt me, I TOLD YOU SO

You do not need to wait 50 years,the effects of anthropogenic climate change are already here!!!!

Definition and etymology

Anthropogenic:

The adjective anthropogenic describes those objects and phenomena that have their origins in the activities of humans. It is compounded of the Greek ‘anthropos’ (human), and the suffix ‘genic’ (having origin in). In the context of environmental science, anthropogenic changes are those transformations of the Earth's atmosphere, biosphere, hydrosphere, lithosphere and pedosphere that result from human action. In the present context this use of the term should be distinguished from the more restricted use made by evolutionary biologists, who employ it to refer to the origins of humans themselves.

The term anthropogenicis common in the scientific literature of Britain, the USA, Russia, France and Germany. Its first use in a technical context can be attributed to the Russian geologist Pavlov in 1922, and a sophisticated exploration of its implications and applications can be found in 20th-century Russian-language scientific writing. Here it is frequently used...

Does that mean when I dig up my garden and plant some foreign vegis I am bein Anthropogenic??

Pebbles wrote:Planetcare, my post was not directed at you.  It just happened that it appeared immediately following yours.

On issues WRT climate change, I am in total accord with your views.

Sorry for that! thank you!

adrian ss wrote:


What else can have happened to cause the planets glaciers, ice and snow fields to begin melting 12,000 years ago?
Prior to the Industrial revolution this melting was already accelerating. If not due to natural cyclical events then what Huh! Go on, What then . What, What ,What!!  I want proof, scientific proof. Nothing is true or real without proof.  

It was actually closer to 20,000 years and was triggered by a rise in atmospheric CO2!!!

I just knew you were going to say that.

So what caused that CO2 increase?

Did the aborigines discover how to light fires and cook their kangaroos and burnt the place to a cinder when the fires got out of control.
As I understand things; approx 24,000-26,000 years ago a warming period ended and a new cooling cycle began, this cooling cycle ended/reached a peak around 12,000 years later and a new warming period began which is still going on today for several thousand more years after which another cooling cycle will begin.....By that time the earth will be covered in wind farm generators and there will be so many solar panels covering the surface of the planet it will act like a gigantic mirror reflecting all the Infrared radiation back into space. Rainfall will cease and the planet will have become an un-repairable dust bowl.......If you want evidence then you will have to hang around for another 4000 years or so.

With better weather on the horizon, I suggest we all get out there & smell the roses gents, or we'll miss out on all that heavenly glory.
No point in bickering amongst ourselves, for that wont help make any change to climate.

Kon

adrian ss wrote:I just knew you were going to say that.

So what caused that CO2 increase?

 

 Orbital effects.ie  the initial warming caused the oceans to degass CO2 which then leads to more warming. Without the effects of C02 the world would have never completely emerged from the ice ages! The present warming cannot be explained by any orbital or precession effects or cycles!!!!! If there were no human influences on climate, Earth's current orbital positions within the Milankovitch cycles predict our planet should be cooling, not warming! This is a cooling trend that began more than 6,000 years ago according to recent research.

We are most definitely in a Warming period. Ice will always exist at the poles to a greater or lesser degree.

Last Glacial Period (LGP)

From Wikipedia.
Origin and definition

The LGP is often colloquially referred to as the "last ice age", though the term ice age is not strictly defined, and on a longer geological perspective, the last few million years could be termed a single ice age given the continual presence of ice sheets near both poles. Glacials are somewhat better defined, as colder phases during which glaciers advance, separated by relatively warm interglacials. The end of the last glacial period, which was about 10,000 years ago, is often called the end of the ice age, although extensive year-round ice persists in Antarctica and Greenland. Over the past few million years, the glacial-interglacial cycles have been "paced" by periodic variations in the Earth's orbit via Milankovitch cycles.

The LGP has been intensively studied in North America, northern Eurasia, the Himalayas, and other formerly glaciated regions around the world. The glaciations that occurred during this glacial period covered many areas, mainly in the Northern Hemisphere and to a lesser extent in the Southern Hemisphere. They have different names, historically developed and depending on their geographic distributions: Fraser (in the Pacific Cordillera of North America), Pinedale (in the Central Rocky Mountains), Wisconsinan or Wisconsin (in central North America), Devensian (in the British Isles),[6] Midlandian (in Ireland), Würm (in the Alps), Mérida (in Venezuela), Weichselian or Vistulian (in Northern Europe and northern Central Europe), Valdai in Russia and Zyryanka in Siberia, Llanquihue in Chile, and Otira in New Zealand. The geochronological Late Pleistocene includes the late glacial (Weichselian) and the immediately preceding penultimate interglacial (Eemian) period.

adrian ss wrote:We are most definitely in a Warming period. Ice will always exist at the poles to a greater or lesser degree.

Last Glacial Period (LGP)

From Wikipedia.
Origin and definition

The LGP is often colloquially referred to as the "last ice age", though the term ice age is not strictly defined, and on a longer geological perspective, the last few million years could be termed a single ice age given the continual presence of ice sheets near both poles. Glacials are somewhat better defined, as colder phases during which glaciers advance, separated by relatively warm interglacials. The end of the last glacial period, which was about 10,000 years ago, is often called the end of the ice age, although extensive year-round ice persists in Antarctica and Greenland. Over the past few million years, the glacial-interglacial cycles have been "paced" by periodic variations in the Earth's orbit via Milankovitch cycles.

The LGP has been intensively studied in North America, northern Eurasia, the Himalayas, and other formerly glaciated regions around the world. The glaciations that occurred during this glacial period covered many areas, mainly in the Northern Hemisphere and to a lesser extent in the Southern Hemisphere. They have different names, historically developed and depending on their geographic distributions: Fraser (in the Pacific Cordillera of North America), Pinedale (in the Central Rocky Mountains), Wisconsinan or Wisconsin (in central North America), Devensian (in the British Isles),[6] Midlandian (in Ireland), Würm (in the Alps), Mérida (in Venezuela), Weichselian or Vistulian (in Northern Europe and northern Central Europe), Valdai in Russia and Zyryanka in Siberia, Llanquihue in Chile, and Otira in New Zealand. The geochronological Late Pleistocene includes the late glacial (Weichselian) and the immediately preceding penultimate interglacial (Eemian) period.

https://climate.nasa.gov/explore/ask-nasa-climate/2949/why-milankovitch-orbital-cycles-cant-explain-earths-current-warming/

When I first began researching (for myself) for information regarding global warming I gathered all of the known facts re our planet, solar system and everything I could get my hands and eyes on about this subject.......Took a while
   I concluded that the cyclical variation in the earths orbital angles might be effecting the climate temps aside from seasonal changes; so began a bit of in depth research which ended in my concluding that the natural cycles of the earth could very likely be the cause of past ice Ages and cooling and warming cycles and that we are now in a cooling phase in the Southern hemisphere and a warming phase in the Northern hemisphere both of which will continue for approx another 5000 years......Or is it visa versa??  I dunno and couldn't give a rats labot

At the time I had never heard of anybody named Milankovitch until somebody on the forum mentioned his name in a reply to one of my posts......That is going back a fair way  like years n years.
   So I googled him and there he was going on about the same stuff that I had been getting stuck in to.

Anyhoo my final conclusions are that it does not matter what any of us think, global warming is happening and cannot be stopped and we will keep arguing as to who is correct, Anti man made global warming advocates or Pro human made global warming advocates.