* BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  moredeep on Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:09 pm

That's it dave ,they can run on hear say but we have to state facts in order for them to believe us .

cheers moredeep

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  moredeep on Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:30 pm





Showed some VEAC members some heavily detected areas that I've been going to for the last 20 years,I asked them could they see the damaged I have caused.
I told them the bush is an amazing creature it repairs its self.Notice abundant new growth.
If you're going to a VEAC meeting please take some photos along with you and show VEAC REPS similar examples.

CHEERS  MOREDEEP

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  Wombat on Thu Sep 13, 2018 8:39 am

I just put up on the Bush User Groups United.
We have just received another fabulous donation of $2,000 towards our Fighting Fund. This time coming from "Minelab Australia". For those that don't know about Minelab Australia, they are a very big Corporation world wide, and a manufacture of metal detectors. "Thank You Minelab for your donation"
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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  MacRob on Thu Sep 13, 2018 9:28 am

Hi Wombat,

I know you have earlier given acknowledgment to a $2000 donation from Minelab, do you mean this is now a total of $4000 from Minelab.

MacRob

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  Wombat on Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:16 pm

No sorry Rob it is the same donation. I'm just acknowledging them with Thanks.
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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  Razorback on Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:29 pm

Perhaps it is time to rethink how we handle the real problem we have at the moment. Our problem is the VEAC process which has never given us a fair go and never will. Even sending a submission is in my view a waste of time and only plays the game by the rules set by VEAC and in fact makes their process credible because we have taken part in it. At the end of the process they will rule against our interests and claim that we had our chance but they did not agree with our views. I was a member of the PMAV for many years, a Branch president for six years and State Vice President for one year. I have a huge respect for the PMAV and all the work that has been done on behalf of ALL prospectors not just financial members in the past. As members we quote the diggers oath and fly the Eureka flag and in doing so we show our respect for what happened at the Eureka Stockade and what those old prospectors achieved for future generations.  Should we ask ourselves " Would the diggers at Eureka have put up with an organisation like VEAC". I think we all know the answer to that question and because of that perhaps we have a duty to those long gone diggers to fight by their rules.
The way forward may be better served if all prospectors and the PMAV were to notify the Premier, and all sitting politicians that we will no longer take part in any process involving VEAC.  History has shown us that we will never be given a fair hearing by VEAC because of the green bias in built into the system, and by stepping away from the process and telling the press why we have done so, we can highlight that bias and undermine VEAC's credibility. By letting every politician in the state know that as a group we will no longer follow the VEAC rules and system we may just convince enough of them that the system is broken and has to change.
I love prospecting and the many friends that I have made through PMAV in the past years, and I know that many of them will not agree with my views on our current problems and that is fine. For my part I will be talking to as many politicians as possible and I will remind them of what the Eureka Stockade was and why it was built. I will also ask them if they want to be part of the Government responsible for the second Eureka Stockade and all the negative press, local, interstate and international that would result from a second non violent digger uprising at a place and time of our choice.


Last edited by Razorback on Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:32 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : mistake)

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  Guest on Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:47 pm

Nicely said Razorback and I agree.
The VEAC is a waste of tax payer $$$ but the grrreens and Labour want themselves to look good buy doing this.
They done care of the money they waste.
They don't care of all the Rural towns that will suffer.
They don't care that the forests are a "soul" refresher.


They only want to lock everything up.

We have a fire that has been burning for over 7 weeks in the GREAT SOUTH EAST NATIONAL PARK and still burning.
It's a huge, huge, actually it's a massive area that's been locked away from the people who it's intended for.
We had another fire burn for over 2 months on Mt Dromedary, another area locked away.
Forests need to be back burned and there's none of that here, even the tracks haven't been graded in years.
We now have Lantana weed growing along the south coast from the Illawarra down to the Victorian border, why because these mongrel greens and conservation groups are good for nothing. They think they are doing everything and everyone a favour but it's the complete opposite.

The Aboriginal people always back burned
It keeps the forests alive and breathing.
After the back burning, the insects and animals have more food, it's called regeneration.

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  MacRob on Sun Sep 16, 2018 11:42 pm

HI Razorback,

I hear where you are coming from and losing the battle against these govt investigations.
If this is to happen, I have always thought that we will need organised civil disobedience in our numbers, in our backyards.
The whole VEAC system is corrupt.

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Post  Wombat on Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:22 pm

Razorback wrote:Perhaps it is time to rethink how we handle the real problem we have at the moment. Our problem is the VEAC process which has never given us a fair go and never will. Even sending a submission is in my view a waste of time and only plays the game by the rules set by VEAC and in fact makes their process credible because we have taken part in it. At the end of the process they will rule against our interests and claim that we had our chance but they did not agree with our views. I was a member of the PMAV for many years, a Branch president for six years and State Vice President for one year. I have a huge respect for the PMAV and all the work that has been done on behalf of ALL prospectors not just financial members in the past. As members we quote the diggers oath and fly the Eureka flag and in doing so we show our respect for what happened at the Eureka Stockade and what those old prospectors achieved for future generations.  Should we ask ourselves " Would the diggers at Eureka have put up with an organisation like VEAC". I think we all know the answer to that question and because of that perhaps we have a duty to those long gone diggers to fight by their rules.
The way forward may be better served if all prospectors and the PMAV were to notify the Premier, and all sitting politicians that we will no longer take part in any process involving VEAC.  History has shown us that we will never be given a fair hearing by VEAC because of the green bias in built into the system, and by stepping away from the process and telling the press why we have done so, we can highlight that bias and undermine VEAC's credibility. By letting every politician in the state know that as a group we will no longer follow the VEAC rules and system we may just convince enough of them that the system is broken and has to change.
I love prospecting and the many friends that I have made through PMAV in the past years, and I know that many of them will not agree with my views on our current problems and that is fine. For my part I will be talking to as many politicians as possible and I will remind them of what the Eureka Stockade was and why it was built. I will also ask them if they want to be part of the Government responsible for the second Eureka Stockade and all the negative press, local, interstate and international that would result from a second non violent digger uprising at a place and time of our choice.

Hi Razorback, I don't know if you were at the PMAV, AGM at Beaufort yesterday (Sunday). We had a Q&A with a lot of Politicians from different parties there. And basically what you are saying about VEAC was brought up at the meeting, saying that we don't recognise credibility of VEAC with the peoples interest at heart except their own personal interests and agenda..
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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  moredeep on Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:51 pm


Totally agree with all of  the above,VEAC are hell bent on their own agenda,
Don't worry about feral animals,feral plants like LANTANA or the many many thousands of self seeded PINE trees around castlemaine.
I think VEAC has blinkers on, they see what they only want to see,no matter how much we tell them.

cheers  moredeep

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  Wombat on Tue Sep 25, 2018 10:45 am


VEAC has extended the submission deadline for its Central West Investigation Draft Proposals Paper from 31 October to Monday 10 December this year, giving members of the public more time to prepare a written submission.

“There is a lot of interest in the draft recommendations and we want to provide people with the information and time they need to prepare their submissions so we have extended the submission closing date,” explains VEAC Chair Janine Haddow. All submissions will be reviewed and analysed and taken into account in preparing VEAC's final recommendations ahead of VEAC providing a Final Report to the Government in 2019.

For more information about the Central West Investigation please visit www.veac.vic.gov.au

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Post  moredeep on Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:44 pm


It's a pity that some of the money spent by VEAC [?around a million bucks] on their draft proposal wasn't used to put a roof over the top of
these aging beauties ,which is our HERITAGE AND CULTURE.

cheers  moredeep

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Post  moredeep on Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:50 pm



more pics Smile

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Post  MacRob on Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:17 pm

Forum comment here on this subject has gone very quiet. For those that are not on Facebook would anyone like to update on what is happening at this point.

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  adrian ss on Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:02 am

Wombat wrote:There are no actual forms to fill in. All they have to do is write something in their own words and submit it.
www.veac.vic.gov.au
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I may be wrong but I think that this is what stops thousands if not millions of Australians today from protesting or submitting anything in writing to councils and members of parliament. They think that they don't know what to write or how to write it even though they may have strong concerns for the future of their freedoms. They think that nobody will take any notice of what they have to say if it is not spoken or written at a high intellectual level or formatted correctly.

Putting your thoughts to paper is not always enough to be effective when the persons reading it are egotistic shiny bums who think themselves to be above mere mortals who will toss your submission in the bin at the sight of just one spelling mistake.

That combined with the fact than Many Australians are becoming apathetic. Life is too easy and people are much lazier mentally and physically today than ever before and cannot be bothered doing anything outside of their safe and protected lifestyle.
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Post  Wombat on Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:49 am

Adrian I agree. Here is my submission. People may get some idea from that.
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My Submission into the Central West Forest Investigation by VEAC
And the reasons why it should not take place.
14th. September 2018

The Loss of:-

Economic benefits
Injection of many millions of dollars into, not only Victoria economy but also into the Australian economy, by all Bush Users spending money on equipment, travel and accommodation. Also money being spent within these regions.

Health Benefits
The physical and metal health benefits for people of all ages by just getting out there and enjoying their chosen activities without restriction. Or in some cases, banned all together. There is a great need for a lot of people, towards their health, to just get away for their everyday working life. It is also a great way of family bonding. This will also helps to relieve the ever increasing strain on our health system.

Economical benefits to Regional Towns
Many Bush User groups and individuals spend from one day to many weeks in these areas enjoying their chosen activities. By them doing so, they in turn spend money in these regional towns. These same towns, that rely on these groups and individual to survive. This is also helping to keep un-employment down within their regions. If these bush activities are removed or restricted the Bush User "WILL NOT" come back to these towns or those areas again. Most towns are even now suffering for drought and low cost for their produce and high cost of living. Especially in regional Victoria. If this happens, not only will it put a massive strain on these towns but also an increasing number on the un-employment line and hardships on peoples living cost. Not to mention the mental strain of possibly losing their homes, incomes, lose of their jobs. The character of their towns will be lost also by closures of business.

Tourism
Tourism will not increase because of new National, Conservation, or Regional Parks. The reason being is you are only dividing State Forest into these new named zones. If what you are say is true, “that these areas are going to be good for tourism”, well my question is “Where are the Tourist now” Why are they not visiting these regions at present??. We are in the bush nearly every day and the only other person we see are fellow bush users enjoying their chosen activities. Just putting a label on something won’t change the content. It will have the same sort of environment as a State Forest. Remember your bush user groups are your tourist. Remove or restrict the bush users, you are removing your tourists. In turn remove the economy of the area.

Firewood collecting
In your draft report you have recommended restrictions to most areas where fire wood collecting was the norm. In doing these recommendations, those areas that you have now chosen for firewood collecting are in a less accessible spots in regions where people will have to travel further to collect their wood. These same areas are smaller in size than the original sites for wood collecting. That in turn will cause more damage to the economy and to the environment. Not to mention that these areas will not be able to sustain and cater for the increase demand, long term. Most people that rely on their firewood collecting can not afford purchasing firewood at $150 + per # ton or putting in electric or gas heating to their homes to just to keep warm in winter.

Horse Riding.
You have put restrictions on horse riding but you have allowed 4 Wheel Driving and Motor Bike riding in the same areas without restrictions “Why” I think you are mainly using the excuse of seeds being in horse droppings.?? We know that most horse riding is done on formed roads and vehicle track. Hence any horse droppings would have very little chance of taking root. Most weed infestations are caused by other native animals and birds, not just horses that visit these same areas. Are you going to stop these animals from entering these same areas as well. “No” so why stop horse riding in the areas ?? Some birds flying thousands of kilometer just to visit these areas as well. They too carry seeds within their droppings. Where do you think the spread of Black Berry Bush's come from,?? "Bird dropping." Not horse droppings. Most other seeds are air born through pollen transfer and wind. Farmer’s are constantly have the problem with weed infestations in their paddocks ,not because they are being visited by horses. But by wind, birds and other animals.

Prospecting and Metal Detecting
This is a very low impact recreational hobby. Not only to the environment but also to the Flora and Fauna. There has never been any case study evidence to prove otherwise. But prospecting on all fronts and levels has been banned in some areas or restricted to smaller zones under your draft report. "Why" The goldfields and gold are only in certain areas and those areas must be maintain for prospectors to carry out their chosen hobby.
The prospector is also an environmentalist by keeping an eye on the bush and how it is treated. Reporting unusual activities and dumping of rubbish. We are also environmentalists by removing many tons of lead shot, tons of scrap metal and other rubbish by working with Parks Victoria in “Clean Up Your Parks Day” The prospector is not only a free asset to the environment but also your free watch dog to these regions. Restricting the prospector you are restricting the Environment of it’s keepers.

Hunting
Hunters and shooters spends many thousand of dollars on their equipment and injects many Millions into the Australian economy. They hunt mostly feral animals that are not only destroying our wild life but also causing havoc to the farmer and the farming communities in general which in turn affects their lively hoods. By removing hunting from all regional parks except State Forests you have put our native animal’s lives in danger. Not every hunter belongs to the SSAA or ADA or any other organization. And why should they??. Both of these are allowed the go into these regions to do pest control under the control of DELWP or Park Victoria at an exorbitant cost to the tax payer. But hunters that don’t belong to any organization will do the same job for free, saving the Tax payer thousands of dollars per year. Hunting has been going on since time began as a recreation and a food sauce. Our regional areas are being plagued with fox’s, wild pigs, wild cats and dogs. And deer that are causing havoc to farmers, their farms, their live stock and to our native animals. Turning our State Forests into new Parks will enhance this problem many times over. As hunting will be banned, these feral animals will live under the safety umberala of these new parks and continue being a problem.

4 Wheel Driving
4 Wheel Driving, Motor Bike Riding and Trail Bike Riding have been granted access to most park regions under your new proposal plan. And that is great, as they are bush users in their own right. But you have restricted other bush users groups that have a lesser environmental impact than all of these groups mentioned, put together. I know that the 4 Wheel Drive Association of Victoria obtains money from the Government to keep open isolated areas of track and bush land. But is this the real reason in your draft for them to basically have a free hand.??

Logging.
It is well know that most environmentalist wants logging stopped in all parts of Victoria. If this happens this will create such a great problem not only to the region that depend on logging but all so to the State of Victoria. Not to mention higher un-employment in the timber industry and local towns. We do have to obtain timber from somewhere, so why not from our own state forests. This will keep jobs alive, economy alive, towns alive and our timber industry alive. All logging in the State of Victoria are being done in re-growth forests not old growth forests. There has never been old growth logging in this State now for over 80 years. The timber industries have very high strict rules and regulation that they have to follow. These regulation have been brought out by the Victorian Government many years ago. If we stop our timber industry here in Victoria, where will we have to sauce our timber from.?? From interstate or overseas were the regulations may be non existence. It is better to keep the money and jobs in this State, than anywhere else.

My conclusions to the Draft are :-
Even though it sounds like a great idea to have more National, Regional and Conservation Park, the damage this will cause out weighs the benefits. The cost to the States economy and the burden to the Tax payer out weighs the benefits. The State Government is already having enough problems trying to maintain the Parks we have now, without more coming on board. The increase possibility of higher un-employment in regional Victoria and the increase burden to the Tax Payer in supporting them. The health risks that it would cause by restricting or even banning some bush user groups from enjoying their activities. The wild life that would be in jeopardy if hunting was banned. The cost of running more Parks compared to State Forests has never been analysed . There has never been a case study to find out if our existing State and National Park are even delivering what the Government said they would, and at what cost to the Tax payer. We need to look into this first, before bring in more parks. Are we gain or loose tourists, coming to these regions ??. Until this has been done “I say "No" to more Parks”


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Post  adrian ss on Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:29 am

Thanks for that Wombat.
Maybe it will give people some clues as to what to mention.

This is pretty basic but worth reading.
It is all happening but very few Victorians are even aware of it taking place.
http://www.veac.vic.gov.au/investigation/central-west-investigation
http://www.veac.vic.gov.au/documents/CWI-DPP-factsheet-5-Recreational-uses.pdf
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Post  Show Me The Gold on Fri Oct 26, 2018 8:52 pm

Dam ill check that out tonight when i get home. It's good to be back onhere though.
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Post  Wombat on Sat Oct 27, 2018 3:12 pm

Yesterday (Friday) BUGU did 3 Commercials ( one 15 second & two 30 second ads) protesting against VEAC & the Green movement in regards to the implications of forming more Parks for Victoria. They will be shown through out regional Vic on WIN Television network, Prime 7 Network and also on Gold FM Bendigo. We had pretty well all bush users represented. The first lot go to Air on Sunday the 4th Nov. The ads were made by Admedia, a part of the WIN corporation. They will be also on Social Media at the same time. This has been made possible by people donating money to our "Go Fund Me" on our BUGU site. We still need more donations so we can complete what we want to do to get the word out to thousands of people.  
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Post  Jen on Sat Oct 27, 2018 8:24 pm

Congratulations to all those that attended   T12

I also just came across this page. Not sure if its been placed up here or not.

http://www.bugu.org.au/?fbclid=IwAR0fUYQ5aJtpwyK2Fh8-GYjNDF6zONXHV3O1z2_42YU5FM37ocugP-rztx0

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Post  Grandfather Johnson on Sat Oct 27, 2018 9:26 pm

Thanks Jen, I have not seen that before. It needs to be circulated so all can see. T06

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Post  MacRob on Sat Oct 27, 2018 11:47 pm

MacRob wrote:Forum comment here on this subject has gone very quiet. For those that are not on Facebook would anyone like to update on what is happening at this point.


Thanks everyone for updating our forum users on the latest happenings, it's appreciated. May it continue.

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Post  Wombat on Sun Oct 28, 2018 7:41 am

Thanks Jen for putting that up. It is one of our latest campaign push of awareness that our team has been working on.
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Post  moredeep on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:59 pm


Must be an election coming up.A response to one of many letters written ,this one from the environment minister recently.
From reading this it's not looking good for the humble prospector?
We are an after thought in the process,and if we are lucky we might get some public land, whoopee do Evil or Very Mad
They also forgot to mention how much PUBLIC land they will give us,I feel like a beggar waiting for some crumbs "thank you master" Mad  Mad  Mad

cheers moredeep

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Post  hapalogh on Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:49 pm

Maybe what we ought to do is get and ask the Government and VEAC combined, to put it in writing,to all clubs and others concerned ,a written agreement and signed and dated by them ,that before and after any Elections or future Elections that we can use existing land now, (dated this day)for the purpose of our hobbies ect, and for our future generations.to look after and enjoy.

Because we all know, that in past Elections they promise the world,but when a party is elected they change the policies tat they promised.

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Post  moredeep on Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:03 pm

Hi Hapalogh,I'd very much doubt that a polli would put themselves in such a position ,there would be a clause or some gobbledygook that would let them wriggle out of any commitment.
An example is clearly seen in the response I got ,notice the word SHOULD [ also meaning probable/maybe] .If they wrote the word WILL that would have lock them into a commitment.
Unfortunately; I've become a doubting Thomas Question

CHEERS MOREDEEP

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Post  ben digo on Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:39 pm

Eureka Dreams wrote:This new Facebook Group began a few days ago and already has 5,484 members!! and growing fast...The group comprises all bush users and those that support the common freedoms of bush users! These like minded members protest against pending changes by stealth to our access to areas we already prospect in / hike in / 4 wheel drive in / fish in / ect.

The moderators are   Alan Salter   Rita Bentley and  Bill Schulz ( Wombat )

So no matter what part of this great country that you come from, please support the fight against these ridiculous abuses of power that the government want to implement!

Eureka Dreams

Absolutely we must pull together. Spread the word people, tell all your contacts.

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  ben digo on Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:42 pm

Wombat wrote:I just put up on the Bush User Groups United.
We have just received another fabulous donation of $2,000 towards our Fighting Fund. This time coming from "Minelab Australia". For those that don't know about Minelab Australia, they are a very big Corporation world wide, and a manufacture of metal detectors. "Thank You Minelab for your donation"
wombat  Wink

Well done to MineLab, hope we get a lot more who can contribute with financial support.

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  ben digo on Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:42 pm

I'll second that. We need to pull out all stops on this ridiculous situation.

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Re: * BUSH USER GROUPS UNITED * Come on one and all and support this Facebook Group of Bush Users concerned about pending changes **

Post  davsgold on Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:47 am

Shocked


Last edited by davsgold on Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
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