A Miners Right - what does it give us?

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Post  Kon61gold on Mon Feb 08, 2010 10:37 pm

Rita Bentley - President of the PMAV wrote

"The Miners Right is worth more than it costs. Other states that have lost their Miners Right miss it with considerable regret. While we have a Miners Right, we have rights to accompany it. If we abandon the Miners Right it would be easy for simple rules and regulations to be introduced that would make prospecting impossible as is rapidly becoming the case in some States.

Hold the document sacred, act with the privilege it brings and enjoy the rights that it endows. These rights were not easily won and are not easily maintained. "

Most of us just buy our Miners Rights on a regular basis without giving any thought other than it is just another tax by the Government.

What are our rights and how does a Miners Right benefit us?

Jeff
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Post  Nightjar on Mon Feb 08, 2010 11:56 pm

Hello members,
Yes, we urge you to apply for a "Miner's Right".
This is the WA link, maybe another member can post other State links?
http://www.dmp.wa.gov.au/1635.aspx
Am very proud of my 'Right" and keep it safe and can produce it when called upon.

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Happy digging in 2010.

Peter
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Post  Beer Beeper on Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:30 am

1) Is it good for the lifetime of a person in all States??


2) With a Miner's Right, if a person is metal detecting in an area of Crown land where there is NO mining tenement and NO pastoralist lease on that Crown land.

Then (either written consent of the mining tenement holder and/or notifying the pastoralist) permission is obviously NOT required to detect and detecting is allowed there with no problems without a Section 20A Permit and/or Exploration Licence, and is legal. Is that true??

(To make it perfectly clear.)

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Post  Nightjar on Wed Feb 10, 2010 11:43 am

Hi Beer Beeper,
What is not perfectly clear.
Are you stating facts or are you asking a question?
West Australian details can be found here;

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/wa/consol_act/ma197881/



This is just section 20 of the Mining Act 1978;


A Miners Right - what does it give us? Tiny-austlii Western Australian Consolidated Acts


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MINING ACT 1978 - SECT 20


20 . General rights to prospect and protection of certain Crown land


(1) The Minister, the Director General of Mines or a mining registrar may issue or cause to be issued to a person upon being satisfied as to the identity of the applicant and payment of the prescribed fee a Miner’s Right which is not transferable and not limited in term and such a Miner’s Right shall be in the prescribed form.

(2) Subject to this Act the holder of a Miner’s Right is authorised to do all or any of the following things —

(a) to pass and repass over Crown land with such employees and agents, vehicles machinery and equipment as may be necessary or expedient for the purpose of prospecting for minerals and marking out of any land which may be made the subject of an application for a mining tenement;

(b) to prospect on —

(i) Crown land that is not the subject of a mining tenement; or

(ii) Crown land that is the subject of an exploration licence if the holder of the Miner’s Right holds a permit to do so under section 20A,

for minerals and conduct tests for any mineral thereon for the purpose of ascertaining whether any part of the land, and if appropriate determining which area, is to be marked out or applied for, or both, for the purpose of making an application for a mining tenement in respect thereof;

(c) to extract or remove samples or specimens of rock, ore or minerals with as little damage to the surface of such land as possible, in quantities, in total or on occasions, not exceeding the prescribed limits, and to keep as his property or to utilise for testing or evaluation purposes any samples and specimens of any mineral found by him on such land;

(d) to take, subject to the Rights in Water and Irrigation Act 1914 , or any Act amending or replacing the relevant provisions of that Act, water from any natural spring, lake, pool or water-course situated in or flowing through such land and subject to that Act to sink a well or bore on such land and take water therefrom and to use the water so taken for the purposes of prospecting and for domestic purposes only; and

(e) to camp on Crown land, for the purpose of prospecting, in such manner and subject to such conditions as may be prescribed; and

(f) subject to the prior written consent of —

(i) any occupier of that Crown land; and

(ii) the holder of the mining tenement concerned,

to fossick by prescribed means on Crown land, whether or not land which is held as a mining tenement.

(3) Any person acting in the exercise or purported exercise of an authorisation conferred or alleged to be conferred by subsection (2) shall —

(a) cause all holes, pits, trenches and other disturbances on the surface of the land which were made while he was so acting and which are likely to endanger the safety of any person or animal, to be filled in or otherwise made safe, together with such other holes, pits, trenches and other disturbances made, wholly or in part, by him as the Minister may from time to time direct;

(b) take all necessary steps to prevent fire, damage to trees or other property and to prevent damage to any property or damage to livestock by the presence of dogs, the discharge of firearms, the use of vehicles or otherwise; and

(c) be liable to pay compensation in accordance with section 123, as may be agreed or as may be determined by the warden’s court on the application of the owner or occupier of the land or of the holder of any mining tenement affected, for any loss or damage caused by, and not made good by, that person in relation to any land or mining tenement while he was so acting,

and a determination made by the warden’s court under this subsection is for the purposes of section 147(1), a final determination of the warden’s court.

[(4) deleted]

(5) Notwithstanding that any Crown land to which this subsection refers may be marked out as or be included in a mining tenement, a mining tenement or Miner’s Right does not entitle the holder thereof to prospect or fossick on, explore, or mine on or under, or otherwise interfere with, any Crown land that is —

(a) for the time being under crop, or which is situated within 100 metres thereof;

(b) used as or situated within 100 metres of a yard, stockyard, garden, cultivated field, orchard, vineyard, plantation, airstrip or airfield;

(c) situated within 100 metres of any land that is in actual occupation and on which a house or other substantial building is erected;

(d) the site of or situated within 100 metres of any cemetery or burial ground;

(e) land the subject of a pastoral lease within the meaning of the Land Administration Act 1997 which is the site of, or is situated within 400 metres of the outer edge of, any water works, race, dam, well or bore, not being an excavation previously made and used for mining purposes by a person other than a lessee of that pastoral lease,

without the written consent of the occupier, unless —

(ea) the warden in relation to any land other than land referred to in paragraph (c) otherwise directs; or

(eb) in the case of mining, it is carried out not less than 30 metres below the lowest part of the natural surface of the land,

but nothing in this subsection prevents such a holder from passing and repassing over any Crown land that is situated within —

(f) 100 metres of any Crown land that is —

(i) for the time being under crop;

(ii) used as a yard, stockyard, garden, cultivated field, orchard, vineyard, plantation, airstrip or airfield;

(iii) in actual occupation and on which a house or other substantial building is erected; or

(iv) the site of any cemetery or burial ground;

or

(g) 400 metres of any Crown land that is the site of any water works, race, dam, well or bore,

in order to gain access to other land (not being Crown land referred to in paragraph (f) or (g)), for the purpose of prospecting or fossicking on, exploring, mining on or under, or marking out that other land but a warden shall not give a direction under paragraph (ea) unless he is satisfied that the land is bona fide required for mining purposes and he is satisfied that compensation in accordance with section 123 for all loss or damage suffered or likely to be suffered by an owner or occupier of the land has been agreed upon or otherwise determined, or is assessed and settled in accordance with this Act.

(5a) The holder of a mining tenement or Miner’s Right who passes or repasses over any Crown land that is situated within —

(a) 100 metres of any Crown land referred to in subsection (5)(f); or

(b) 400 metres of any Crown land referred to in subsection (5)(g),

in order to gain access to the other land referred to in subsection (5) for the purpose referred to therein shall —

(c) before so passing or repassing, take all reasonable and practicable steps to notify the occupier of the Crown land so situated of his intention to do so;

(d) when so passing or repassing —

(i) take all necessary steps to prevent fire, damage to trees or other property and to prevent damage to any property or damage to livestock by the presence of dogs, the discharge of firearms, the use of vehicles or otherwise;

(ii) cause as little inconvenience as possible to the occupier of the Crown land so situated; and

(iii) comply with any reasonable request made by the occupier of the Crown land so situated in relation to the manner in which that holder so passes or repasses;

(e) restrict the number of occasions on which he so passes or repasses to the minimum necessary for the purpose of prospecting or fossicking on, exploring, mining operations on or under, or marking out that other land; and

(f) make good any damage caused by that passing or repassing to any improvements or livestock on the Crown land so situated,

and the occupier of the Crown land so situated is entitled to be compensated by that holder for any damage referred to in paragraph (f) that is not made good by that holder, and, in respect of land under cultivation, for any other loss or damage for which that holder is liable in accordance with section 123.

(5b) The amount of any compensation payable under subsection (5a) by the holder of the mining tenement or Miner’s Right concerned to an occupier of Crown land referred to in that subsection shall be determined —

(a) by agreement between that holder and that occupier; or

(b) in default of agreement, by the warden’s court on the application of that holder or that occupier.

(5c) A determination made by the warden’s court under subsection (5b) is, for the purposes of section 147(1), a final determination of the warden’s court.

[Section 20 4 amended by No. 122 of 1982 s. 6; No. 100 of 1985 s. 13; No. 22 of 1990 s. 5; No. 31 of 1997 s. 141; No. 63 of 2000 s. 4; No. 15 of 2002 s. 5; No. 39 of 2004 s. 50 and 88.]





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Cheers
Peter
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Post  Kon61gold on Wed Feb 10, 2010 11:03 pm

Thats excellent Peter - thanks. Being applicable to Crown land it would appear that it would be similar in other States. Maybe some of our members can check it out.

Jeff
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Post  Kudu on Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:26 am

I think its a good idea that the Miner's Right, and everything that goes along with it, be debated.

I am fairly new to prospecting but up untill today, I have yet to see the benefits of a Miner's Right.

Because I am working shifts, I do have a lot of opportunities to do short daytrips in an around town, searching for the big find. I also try to maintain a high level of moral ethics in life and that includes my current hobby, which is of course, prospecting for gold nuggets. With this I mean that I endeavour to do the right things right everytime. I don't think I have to elaborate.

Now, anybody can apply and will be issued with a Miner's Right, which gives you a "legal permission" to go and do prospecting with the understanding that you adhere and abide by the "rules", "principles" or "agreements" as contained in said document. However, there is too much evidence out there that proves that the so called "owners" of Miner's Rights are not playing by the "rules" and do not adhere to their part of the "agreement". This, I think, is common knowledge and is the old 80/20% principle at work! When people are allowed to go where-ever they want to, do whatever they want to, and get away with it, then the purpose of such a document is worthless. I have yet to see anybody to ask for my Miner's Right. I used to carry mine in my vehicle when prospecting, but since nobody has ask for it, I now leave it at home where I know it is save and won't get lost.

I am not advocating the policing of prospectors or prospecting areas. We know it is impossible and our normal daily life is already locked up in too many rules and regulations.

My suggestion, and its only a suggestion in opening a debate, is to give the Miner's Right a bit more weight or substantion.

Think about this: I am a member of APLA and I have also just applied for membership at a prospecting club. I did not need to show them any evidence of a Miner's Right. I also sold a bit of my finds fairly recently. Again, did'nt have to show my miner's right.

By making it a pre-requisite to show your Miner's Right in certain "prospecting transactions" we will be able to add some substance to this document and by doing so, will also be able to convert some of the 80% over to the 20%.

In conclusion: We all love our prospecting, but even for a novice like me, the writing is on the wall. WE need to hold onto what we've got and by giving the Miner's Right a better reason for existance, will, to my mind only assist in our efforts of guarding what is precious to us.

Regards

Kudu
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Post  Nightjar on Thu Feb 11, 2010 12:35 pm

Morning Kudu,
While I agree with some of what you state you have however got some of your facts wrong.
"I am a member of APLA and I have also just applied for membership at a prospecting club. I did not need to show them any evidence of a Miner's Right"

On an APLA membership form it clearly shows you must submit your Miners Right number.
http://www.apla-prospectors.org.au/

ISU representatives do go out into the field and do check prospectors Miners Rights, only last year their presence was strongly felt in the Leonora area. While many warnings were issued I do not know of anyone being fined.

Yes we do need to get the 80% onboard.

Cheers
Peter
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Post  jayvee on Thu Feb 11, 2010 2:01 pm

Yes peter,100% correct,our experience with miners rights,ask permission from mineing companys,you are asked for 1 miners right 2 personal liability insurance proof of minimum $1,000,000 3 personal id. and then permission granted,we have never been refused.and pastrolists of course.cul peter john&val.
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Post  bencld on Thu Feb 11, 2010 5:43 pm

I have had a miners right for as long as I have been detecting (28 years or so) and have never once had to produce it. From what I understand (in Vic) is that gold belongs to the crown and if you don't have a right the crown can take it ? So I think that my miners right has been cheap insurance (compared to house and contents and car over the years). A just in case. I never kept any of my rights up until now unlike my great great great great uncle ! I wonder if he found anything ?
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Post  Harb on Thu Feb 11, 2010 11:03 pm

Wow thats pretty cool to have that....
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