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Post  MS on Sun Dec 13, 2009 7:02 am

It's getting close to 20 months since the 4500 hit the market wonder if
anyone has heard anything about the new model yet, are the dealers
taking names down now .
I would have thought the bulk of the 4500 sales would have dropped off
by now and there would be many holding off for the new model.
Who over in Sudan is supposed to be buying up all the 4500 s , surely
there are not thousands of people over there cashed up and able to do
so.
If there was such a gold rush going on to the extent that we are lead
to believe , why arn't all the other models being snapped up and being
used over there too.
As anyone in this game knows the big gold on fresh undetected grounds
is well within reach of any model that can handle the ground and there
are many models and makes that can do this.
Yes I agree gold is being found over there but I also think a bit of a game
is being played out here.

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Post  Celeste on Sun Dec 13, 2009 2:24 pm

Yet another case of acute GPX Denial? 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_biggrin
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Post  MS on Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:31 pm

Hi Celeste
Just pick up any old gem and treasure mag and you will see what I mean , you don't see heaps of big gold stories and patches like that now
and they were all found in large quantities with A2B upto the 2200s , just look at what you read and see now.
Yes the 4500s are good at the smaller gold left here but they don't need that over in Sudan do they !

Mark
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Post  Guest on Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:06 pm

Hi Mark
The situation as I understand it to be.
Demand is outstripping supply.If you wanted to buy a Gpx4500 say thru Coiltek Maryborough (who incidently have not raised their prices) you go on a list.Australian Minelab distributors do not have a license to sell offshore.They can sell to anyone that approaches them directly.The shortage has been going on for months,with Australian Distributors being Dripfed and supplying there customers when they recieve stock.
Speculation
Someone somewhere is making a fortune by selling Gpx4500s to Sudan because as you know even $300 Goldsnoop would be usefull there.My best guess.Gpx4500s are being sold for gold at massive markups.If the middlemen who are controlling this process allow any other machine in they loose control.To add to this no coils are going that way as far as I know.Just your stock standard Gpx4500.So it cant be about performance and the end user is obviously none the wiser.
We have all heard about the exploitation of tribespeople in the Diamond trade,so it is possible that is happening with gold.As i said the above is only speculation But this theory does make some sense towards what is going on.Does anyone have any other ideas
Cheers Dig

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Post  MS on Mon Dec 14, 2009 10:40 am

Hi Dig
I agree with what you said and that at least makes some sense with what is
going on over there , someone is manipulating the market and there is no
commonsense reason for only the 4500 to being used over there .
The edge and advantage for the 4500 is to pick up what others may have
left behind and the best first action plan on a new rich field like
that would be to cover the ground with as many machines and operators
as possible to find the easy larger gold .

Celeste ,As for me being in denial I would have thought that anyone
with half a brain can see this current situation of low supply and high
price has gone on too long and what a joke it is for anyone who dares
to say something, that may be taken to go against ML or their latest
offering in some way.
What gains or vested interests are there for some people on here to
continually push the ML wagon and defend them to such a degree.
I would say this is a case of Denial ,with the real objective to use
this forum to make close association with a certain manufacturer for
their own gains ,being either financial or ego.
mark
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Post  Inhere on Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:13 pm

"As anyone in this game knows the big gold on fresh undetected grounds
is well within reach of any model that can handle the ground and there
are many models and makes that can do this."



Maybe it was that word that got you that responce Mark. how many makes can you name,
or maybe you are starting to sound a bit like the supoz mob.

Have you ever thought that the world is still on life support and that componants may be hard to
buy? My understanding is that they have trouble sourcing componants for even the 2200v2.
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Post  MS on Mon Dec 14, 2009 5:53 pm

Hi Inhere
Good to see you back on here
Have no idea what supoz mob is though.
I have no preference for any make or model , just like to have something
that works at a fair price.
I'm happy with what I use but are thinking of an upgrade next year to
the latest ML if it will give me more performance and be a worthwhile
exercise in relation to cost .
Have seen the 4500 in action and are not going to upgrade to that as I
don't believe the advantage to be great enough to justify the extra
expense.
My post was to see if anyone has heard of the next model which would
normally be coming out soon and also if people are putting names down
yet.
As for the denial response from me , if someone wants to have a go they
had better be prepared to receive and remember ML is based in Adelaide
as are I .
Adelaide is a small place and one of my best friends worked for Codan
for many years and soon after the takover ,was offered the latest unit
at cost + % so I do have some idea of what things cost .
Am I anti minelab the answer is not at all, but it does turn my stomach
on here sometimes see all the butt kissing going on , and there has to
be some reason for a few on here to jump to the defense of ML if anyone
dare says anything other than the latest model is the best and they can
charge whatever they want and if you are real lucky you may be able to
get one in a few months.
Also this Sudan excuse is wearing a bit thin, and the lack of
components, funny how they soon found what was required to service
older models again and are able to meet the large sales contract to
India with no problems.
Forums should be open to all views and be a platform to share knowledge
in using , ML, Whites, or whatever make model unit and even modded
units at that, at the end of the day who cares what someone else is
using unless they are finding more gold than you.
Mark
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Post  Inhere on Mon Dec 14, 2009 10:26 pm

Mark, the Sudan excuse is very real, local people ARE buying the 4500's + coils and batteries and on selling to people to sell in Sudan.

Why they don't buy earlier M/lab Pi's is a puzzle, I'd like to have even a 2000 over there.

People love M/labs for all sorts of reasons, there are those that get enough gold to pay for them in a short time and others that just get enjoyment in using the best gold detector on the market and picking up bits here and there. No one is going to get any kudos from M/lab
for defending them, but they are the best in the world for finding gold and I think they have attained a sort of generic status for gold detecting, a bit like coke for cola.

I think you should see someone who knows how to really use a 4500, from what I see plenty of people fall short in that area.
They are a lot better then a 3500 in hot ground.
I can't see a new model coming anytime soon, the 4500 is still selling well, when you can get one.
It's a funny thing, none of the M/lab Pi's have ever been anything like perfect, including the 4500 but no one else has even made a gold detector that is as good as a 2100.
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Post  Nightjar on Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:23 am

How's it going In'here,
I fully support your theory about the 2100. 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_cheers The gold discovery stories coming out of Africa would support the use of the very first metal detectors. 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_idea
As for the Sudan wanting only only 4500's, is, only equalled to the Climate Change scam, more dollars for the "fatcats".
3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_evil 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_evil 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_evil 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_evil
Peter
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Post  Guest on Tue Dec 15, 2009 8:34 am

Gday


The reason people are so defensive about minelabs is because they are simply the best available detector on the market at this time, for gold prospecting, like it or not, what other machine on the market is producing the same results in the field?.

For all the bullcrap I have heard over the years about all these other detectors, thats all its ever turned out to be bullcrap, not once have I seen one of these other machines even come close to the minelabs, not even close to any of the earlier models.

I have no vested interest in minelab, but I do support them as I have recieved so much pleasure from using their products and have to honestly say that the machines I have had over the years have all paid for themselves, that I cant deny.

However I am quite puzzled when I hear people say that the gpx4500 is not better than previous models, as I simply would not go back to any previous model that I have owned, there are of course shortfalls with it and one would be its issues with emi, but at least there are things you can do to minimise the effect, but I have found that the benefits of using it far outweigh its shortfalls.

Im not bagging other established brands of detectors as there are some other good products about, that are good for what they were made for, like coin and relic machines, such as garrett and whites, but they are just that, none of these manufacturers have produced anything close to the 4500 to date, that will match it in operation on our goldfields, true or false?

The goings on in Sudan is for real, as I have had first hand information from people I know who are in the region, and I think that the reason that they are only wanting the 4500 is because they have been told that its the only machine that will do the job, so the sellers can get their inflated prices for them and keep their control over the monopoly that they have created, if they start offering cheaper earlier models, or allow others to sell them, then they will lose out on the huge profits they make, I cant see them letting that happen while they can still get their hands on 4500s.

cheers

stayyerAU

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Post  mulgadansa on Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:08 pm

Gday Mark
I'd prefer it if more people used other brands of machine as opposed to ML gear:)
Been running the 4500 since May last year and there have been very few old patches that I've been to that haven't yielded gold up, where other detectors have been flogged there for the past 30 years.
They really are something out of the hat when it comes to nullifying ground noise and hot rocks and that makes all the difference when it comes to hearing that little twitch that someone has missed with all their background noise.
I've watched and listened to guys out there using 3000's, 3500's and even 4000's and they are like chalk and cheese compared to the 4500.
Probably makes sense to now wait for the new model to come out I guess, but I'm wondering at what cost, given the precedents set by recent sales of the 4500 overseas?
cheers
Brett
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Post  Qld Sandy on Tue Dec 15, 2009 1:16 pm

mulgadansa wrote:Gday Mark
I'd prefer it if more people used other brands of machine as opposed to ML gear:)
cheers
Brett

Any suggestions as to what mate?
Cheers.
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Post  mulgadansa on Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:40 pm

Pretty well anything Sandy, then I could come in and clean up behind them 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_biggrin
cheers
Brett
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Post  Inhere on Tue Dec 15, 2009 9:12 pm

G'day nightjar,
mate, don't get me started on the Climate Change scam. 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Affraid
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Post  Guest on Wed Dec 16, 2009 12:43 am

Qld Sandy wrote:
mulgadansa wrote:Gday Mark
I'd prefer it if more people used other brands of machine as opposed to ML gear:)
cheers
Brett

Any suggestions as to what mate?
Cheers.

Nemesis, Pulse Devil, QED 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_lol

My loyalty is to what ever works the best at the time, be it ML, Whites, Garrett, yada yada yada

I'll happily jump ship if something better comes along.. frankly though I cant see that happening in the near future

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Post  llanbric on Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:02 am

My philosophy as well Tuna.

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Post  Guest on Wed Dec 16, 2009 1:54 pm

Yerp id agree with the mad one as well no brand name loyalty here, what ever works the best.
Regards
John

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Post  deutran on Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:53 am

ML or monopoly?Just out of curiosity how many veiwing this forum are using a microsoft operating system.I'm just as guilty using my ML,the reason is when I buy one I know it works.Its a real shame though because competition would give us better detectors and price at the end of the day.
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Post  MS on Sun Dec 20, 2009 7:43 pm

Thinking on the progression of the ML PI detectors, I wonder if the transmitting power level for the 4500 is already at the maximum allowable level for a device which I'm sure must meet some form of standards to be able to be sold and the sensitivity is the only area that has been improved upon.
With the 4500 sensitivity now at the point of being affected by EMI, that well could be as good as we be able to get and there may not even be much more that they can do.
Anyway just a thought and this also could be the reason for no news of a new model.
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Post  Celeste on Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:56 am

Wait until the 24 months are up. 4500 has only been out for about 20 months so far. Everyone wanted a new model last Christmas! Some members here even said 1 was definitely being released by last February! Rumors everywhere on other forums but nothing solid yet. Wait until March/April. 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_wink Should also be a GPX Lite to replace the SDs out soon.

The GPX is already said 2 be on the threshold of legal EMI output limitations. If true, any more output & they might not be able 2 sell them in Australia.
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Post  spidertice on Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:16 pm

Celeste wrote:Wait until the 24 months are up. 4500 has only been out for about 20 months so far. Everyone wanted a new model last Christmas! Some members here even said 1 was definitely being released by last February! Rumors everywhere on other forums but nothing solid yet. Wait until March/April. 3500, 4000 , 4500,  ..?.. Icon_wink Should also be a GPX Lite to replace the SDs out soon.

The GPX is already said 2 be on the threshold of legal EMI output limitations. If true, any more output & they might not be able 2 sell them in Australia.

what do you mean by legal emi out put marco
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Post  nero_design on Sat Dec 26, 2009 10:56 am

LOL! I haven't posted in this thread, Peanut.
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Post  MS on Sat Dec 26, 2009 11:53 am

Hi Celeste
It will be interesting to see what they have come up with when it finally comes out, hope it will be worthwhile and not just a digital front and back end.
A simple GPX would be a good idea as a lower grade model choice as how many have the time or wish to go through a multitude of settings , I'm sure by now it has been worked out what are the best settings and that is all is really needed for most situations.
Cheers Mark


Last edited by MS on Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post  spidertice on Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:09 pm

nero_design wrote:LOL! I haven't posted in this thread, Peanut.

Whoops sorry celeste,,
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Post  Guest on Mon Dec 28, 2009 7:15 am

Gday


It seems that the obvious direction to go is making the gpx more lightweight, and even though there have been some real changes in coils (well not really from minelab) I mean from Coiltek and Nuggetfinder in the areas of weight you still have to consider the balance of the overall machine which up to now seems to have been based on it fitted with the standard 11" dd coil.

What I mean is that you could possibly end up with a gpx type machine that is super lightweight, built say on the lines of a Eureka gold or similar, but because of the super light weight design you are going to be restricted in the size of the coils that you are going to be able to use on it, due to balance of the machine, so that leaves the area of design of a new generation of suitable coils open to minelab as well.

Although the minelab coils are excellent coils to use they are the heaviest available, so the obvious option for the end user is to go for the aftermarket coils, we have seen some real changes in this area over the last couple of years and the reason for this is simple, its because of the competition between Coiltek and Nuggetfinder, the reason we have not seen really drastic changes in the overall design of the Minelabs appearance and basic layout is there has been no competiton in this area, there have of course been improvements in it electronics, and a change in the battery but apart from that very little money has been spent in the area of making it more compact.

There is no reason that I can see why the gpx detectors cant go this way, as much of the gold that is found is small and generally shallow, so there would be a definate place for a lightweight machine with the same capability as the gpx, the 4500 has astounding depth with small coils, last time away I snagged a specie with 13 grams in it,at about 16" down, using a minelab 8" mono coil, due to the spinifex.

A fully capable and lightweight machine like that would be great for patch hunting and investigating new areas, where you could just pull up, grab the detector and pick and have a quick sniff about with the confidence of knowing if there is gold there it will be able to find it, not like using a vlf machine, and without the hassle of getting all the harness and that on.

cheers

stayyerAU

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Post  Guest on Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:13 pm

Can't wait for either the 4800 or the 5000 specifications to be released, hopefully we will see them in April 2010.

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